Age of the queen

[Jon]

There is a lot of talk about queens not living as long.
I have one going into her third winter and she is still laying a good pattern.
Anyone got an older one than that?

I requeened most of my colonies this summer and the majority mated in June and July.
I still have about 4 with a blue spot - the best of last years batch.

Apparently Brother Adam preferred to wait until a queen was about 3 years old before he used it as a breeder, the logic being that you are not grafting from an unknown quantity.

[Adam]

I've got a couple that are going into their third winter. The 'varroa damaged' one and a carni queen that was in a mini-nuc most of the summer so she hasn't overdone the egg-laying this year. However I put her and her mini-nuc over a full-sized nuc and she moved down and laid up three frames amazingly quickly this August/September so she's still got some ooomph in her. The daughter of the carni queen above is not a blue spot but a blue antenna that lays as well as her mum. Both a bit swarmy though.

My best performing blue spot queen - a big fat girl - did not swarm this year - not even a queen cup and gave me 7 supers. I really hope she survives the winter - and I wouldn't want to wait another year before breeding from her. However she's a hybrid. Second generation from an Italian mother, so who knows what I'll get. Her two sisters were culled due to bad temper. She's OK for temper of her bees - they are fine - apart from a wee while after the OSR finished when they were a bit buzzy during inspections.

[Jon]

The two I did all my grafting from this summer, both 2010 queens, made no attempt to swarm but one was superseded in July which took me by surprise. There was a week or so when I could not find either the marked and clipped queen or young larvae for grafting - and then a new laying queen appeared out of nowhere. I never worked out where they hid the supersedure cell.

I was thinking that a lot of beekeepers might struggle to keep a queen for 3 years before grafting as Brother Adam recommended.

[Adam]

I was thinking that a lot of beekeepers might struggle to keep a queen for 3 years before grafting as Brother Adam recommended.

I think you're right. I might just have to try to see how long I can keep a queen going for. Restrict the size of the colony so she doesn't lay too many eggs and so there's never a desire to swarm. The 'carni' queen that's going into her third winter actually killed two supercedure queens that emerged in her hive this September. One emerged and was gone, then another supercedure cell came, that queen emerged too and then was no more.

[Jon]

I have a queen mated in June which I used to requeen a colony in late July and it produced 3 supersedure cells at the start of September. I removed two cells leaving things to take their course. Last time I looked a couple of weeks ago the marked and clipped queen was still there and I didn't see a virgin so she may also have dispatched it. One of the two cells I removed hatched in an apidea and the queen mated late September and I used it to requeen a nuc last week. Queens which arise from supersedure cells are often the best you get as they are so well fed.

This early supersedure business is definitely a big factor in queen longevity although I didn't see as much of it this year as I did the previous year.

[Jon]

Why did I open my big mouth.
I was checking stores in the colony with the elderly queen I mentioned in the opening post and I found 4 queen cells.
I then checked carefully and there was no sign of her.
There was some open brood so it looks like she has been gone about a week.
I removed the 4 cells.
I still have 8 mated queens in apideas, several are daughters of hers as it turns out, and I also have a couple of small nucs so I will either requeen it or combine the colony with one of the nucs.
I was wondering if that warm spell 10 days ago induced bees to do stupid things such as swarming or supersedure at this late stage of the year.

[Dan]

Most years I have a handful of 4 year old queens, but so far have not seen any fives. That's out of 120-140 colonies.