Oh ....

[gavin]

Hi Folks

Here are some photos from one of my own colonies. Am I kidding myself that they might be just chalkbrood? Probably ....

G.

The frame:

http://www.sbai.org.uk/images/another%20one.jpg

Closer ...

http://www.sbai.org.uk/images/closer.jpg

closest, one of them ...

http://www.sbai.org.uk/images/closest1.jpg

and another

http://www.sbai.org.uk/images/closest2.jpg

and the last ...

http://www.sbai.org.uk/images/closest3.jpg

Doesn't look good, does it? I'll see what the professionals say. In the meantime a planned flit to rasps is off, and full hygiene precautions are in place.

G.

[Troutnabout]

I'm new to all this, so I'll ask a question:
Are you refering to the larvae that are not lying nice and flat in the cells? in your 3rd pic its the larvae in the centre of the 4the row of cells from the top. In the 4th pic its the cell nearest the centre of the pic and finally its the two larvae next to each other????

[gavin]

Yup, TNA, those are the dodgy cells. They *might* have chalkbrood as that fungal disease causes larvae to adopt unusual positions (sometimes) but I'm on full paranoia alert at the moment over European foulbrood. That one causes larvae to twist, melt down, wax-like, or go mushy, brown and smelly if sealed over before dying. The first is very common, the second is a serious disease that will get worse over time. It is 'notifiable', and as I have suspicions I've just told the inspectors about my concerns. It is the law.

[Calum]

it could be inbreeding... there are alot of holes in the frame on the first picture. It looks like the bees have reopened up the cells after they were closed - so they are cleaning out cells they dont like. Deformed shape or pupating? Hope its not EFB / AFB / Chalkbrood. Will keep my fingers crossed for you! Keep us updated !

[Jimbo]

I'm no expert but a few of the larvae are not lying in the normal C shape. It could still be the early stages of chalk brood. Is there any other cells with chalk brood in the hive? The weather has not been good so if there is no nectar going in chalk brood will show up more but usually sorts itself with a nectar flow or with feeding. I would not say it was inbreeding as a lot of the empty cells are next to where the wire is in the foundation Bees tend not to use these cells (you can see the wire pattern in the first picture)

[gavin]

I have far too much chalkbrood in my hives. Now that we are getting into breeding maybe I can do something about that. More frequent comb replacement might help too. I too am unconvinced that inbreeding has much to do with it - the brood pattern in that hive is a lot better than some of the others! I'll let you know what the real experts say. Perhaps I'm putting too much pressure on them with all this exposure, if so I apologise.

[Calum]

Right enough Jim there are alot of of empty cell besides the ones along where the wire is. There are an awful lot besides them aswell though- I count more than 50.
Thats an awful lot.

[Jimbo]

Hi Gavin,
I would try feeding first to see if the chalk brood clears up. If not then you may have to re-queen. Is the ventilation good? sometimes poor ventilation and dampness can give you problems. It will be interesting in what the experts say. Do they use a kit to test?

[Jimbo]

Just had a thought. The pictures show frames with no bees and only a few cells that the larvae look strange. How many beekeepers actually shake off their bees and examine the brood.

[gavin]

Yes, there is a lateral flow strip test which they carry for uncertain cases. There is knack to using them, particularly the choice of the right kind of larva. Too old and the original pathogenic bacteria have been replaced. I suppose that it is the lack of proper melting down that gives me hope this is not EFB.

The site isn't damp and I can't recall whether that colony has an OMF or a solid floor. That frame doesn't look too bad for chalkbrood compared to some (just like the brood pattern!). The colony in the other thread, the one I'm fairly sure has EFB, has a dreadful amount of chalkbrood and a terrible brood pattern. Varroa is contributing in that one too.

[gavin]

Yes, I was keen to find out what was happening in that one so - despite the cool afternoon (about 13C) - I shook the bees into the box from all the frames with brood. It was packed with bees and they were none too pleased.

Beekeepers really should have an inspection specifically to look for brood disease and this is the ideal time to do it as EFB is more likely to be showing itself. Take out a couple of non-brood frames, clear a space, and give the frame a sharp tug while held in the space.

Look for AFB (and also EFB) under cappings that are a little different. Darker, ruckled, perforated? Knock the capping off. Look for EFB (and also AFB!) in open brood, even small larvae can be affected. Twisted or melted down larvae indicate EFB.

[Neils]

Just had a thought. The pictures show frames with no bees and only a few cells that the larvae look strange. How many beekeepers actually shake off their bees and examine the brood.
I do. Primarily I tend to do this as part of my swarm control (or is it management? the bit before you think they're likely to be swarming) but otherwise I do a shake of approximately 1/3rd of the brood frames maybe once per month. I don't like "needlessly" shaking bees off frames, but I think taking a good look at the brood on several frames in a colony is worth doing relatively frequently.

I know it's a subtle distinction but I look for brood/bees that are unusual when I inspect, if I see something on a frame then it definitely gets cleared of bees so I can get a better look. When I first started out I looked for everything being "Bright, White and Curled up tight". Problem with that is you're expecting to see it so that's what you tend to spot. If you're actively looking for everything that isn't that, I found that much easier to see [potential] problems as the normal brood fades into the background, so to speak.

[Karin]

:(

I got a repeat EFB alert today. I hope that done't mean two poor souls in the area now have it.

I am looking at all the open brood in the colonies extra carefully, shaking about a third of the frames to look for the tell tale melted looking larva.

Not seen anything noteworthy yet, save I have a few colonies with bald brood.

[Neils]

Fingers crossed. We were lucky in Bristol last year, there were pockets of it all around but it never quite seemed to hit us in the city. Probably just as well in terms of bee population this is pretty densely packed so I'd imagine it'd have a field day if it took hold.

[Dan]

Not good. EFB can develop late in sealed cells, as in the ones you see that have been reopened. In the last picture, the lower dodgy larva looks as if it's developing the yellowed snout of a classic chalkbrood mummy, but the larva above it is concerning.