todays news

[Jon]

Did someone post a year or two ago that this could be broom or am I imagining that. Is the broom even in flower yet?

[GRIZZLY]

Apparently broom produces abundant pollen but no honey - so perhaps not that.

[drumgerry]

Broom starting here in Speyside but I've no experience of it producing honey which, of course, isn't to say it doesn't. Always thought the pollen was akin to gorse or whins as we call it here ie vibrant orangey colour.

On a side note we had our first nice day in ages here today and many colonies have very depleted stores. Need to feed a fair few - something I find galling at this time of year! Plus - not a hint of a swarm cell to be found yet. Still a couple of weeks yet before we have to worry about that I suspect.

[gavin]

Mystery honey. Bees arriving back to the hive with faces covered in bright yellow pollen . The wax comb is chrome yellow and the honey it contains is bright yellow , with a not very pleasant taste. It also has a quite unpleasant smell. It's got me puzzled., anyone got any ideas as to its identification please.

Yellow faces at this time of year are often OSR. OSR honey is, of course, pale in the liquid state and often when cold has a glassy look to it.

Yellow wax and yellow odd-tasting honey - could that be dandelion?

Off in a minute to spend another happy hour with a Tacwise nail gun :-)

[Black Comb]

Mystery honey. Bees arriving back to the hive with faces covered in bright yellow pollen . The wax comb is chrome yellow and the honey it contains is bright yellow , with a not very pleasant taste. It also has a quite unpleasant smell. It's got me puzzled., anyone got any ideas as to its identification please.

Sounds like dandelion. Smells of sweaty socks.

[GRIZZLY]

Sounds like dandelion. Smells of sweaty socks.

The wife has done some research and we agree it is probably dandelion- which the French call " pissenlit " or " piss the bed ". The bees from 4 hives are involved and must have found several fields blanketed in dandelion flowers to draw 4 supers and fill with unripened honey. I don't think I will be jarring too much of the stuff. Thanks for the interest.
Glad the Tacwise is working for you Gavin - you must have a more delicate touch than me.

[gavin]

The wife has done some research and we agree it is probably dandelion- which the French call " pissenlit " or " piss the bed ". The bees from 4 hives are involved and must have found several fields blanketed in dandelion flowers to draw 4 supers and fill with unripened honey. I don't think I will be jarring too much of the stuff. Thanks for the interest.
Glad the Tacwise is working for you Gavin - you must have a more delicate touch than me.

Some honeys that are distasteful, toxic or just odd change with storage as the chemicals responsible break down. Maybe the dandelion honey will taste better after a while. Or maybe you can find someone who likes it and is happy to buy it. Some folk like ivy honey, and others dislike heather honey. Takes all kinds ....

The Tacwise is coming in very useful, thanks Grizzly. There is the occasional jam and a proportion of nails need a tap with a hammer to finish them off but it is still a major improvement over nail and fingers (never a good combination!). I haven't timed it but it wouldn't surprise me if I'm getting twice the number assembled in a set period of time. As I'm heading for 50-60 colonies over the summer that is a big help!

[Jon]

The nail gun I got from Lidl for £9.99 is a vast improvement on a hammer and fingers. It's not perfect as some nails need to be tapped home with the hammer but I am very pleased with it. I think I still have about 500 frames to put together.

[gavin]

Oh dear. Rough guess at 700 to go for me as long as I get a reasonable honey crop. Wish I'd done them in the winter ....

[greengumbo]

I had a pollen trap on three of my hives for the CSI project. It must have been a bonnie day as after 24 hours a single hive had filled 2 x 1lb jars with pollen ! Unbelievable. Most of it was sycamore I think.

Bees are next to a lovely wee woodland but I never expected even a quarter of that.

What can I do with pollen other than make patties next spring ? Must be a market for it somewhere ! Gourmet foodie types ?

[busybeephilip]

Yes there is a small market for it.

I bought a nice pollen trap a lot of years ago from thornes, really well made in cedar 18 inch square with a big drawer at the back. Like you I got lots of pollen BUT...soon discovered that the hive stopped building up and went into early decline the reason being that it was being starved of pollen so dont keep the trap on the whole time. Not sure if the CSI project takes this into consideration ?

[Jon]

I am collecting pollen at Minnowburn for the CSI project. The traps are left on for 1-3 days at 3 week intervals.
I am using the Thorne 'fairweather' traps which are not so good but you usually get enough for a sample.

[busybeephilip]

Yeh, its amazing all the different colors that you get.

[Jon]

I am getting 5 or 6 pollen types on average.

[fatshark]

What can I do with pollen other than make patties next spring ? Must be a market for it somewhere ! Gourmet foodie types ?

I was at one of those 'health food/organic-type cafes on Sunday where they were selling pollen in jars for £££ … can't remember what I'm afraid, but they had some very ordinary honey for £7.15/lb on the same shelf if I remember correctly.

When I set up the Ben Harden queen rearing upper box I often just use a frame of drawn comb sprinkled liberally with pollen (by which I mean a few tablespoons full of the stuff) facing the grafted queens. It all goes …

What about this stuff on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Natural-Bee-Pollen-Granules-Natures-Complete-Food-Harvested-From-Spain-/111667909987?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item19ffed1563) … which appears to be collected by a very hoverfly-looking bee ;)

[greengumbo]

I was at one of those 'health food/organic-type cafes on Sunday where they were selling pollen in jars for £££ … can't remember what I'm afraid, but they had some very ordinary honey for £7.15/lb on the same shelf if I remember correctly.

When I set up the Ben Harden queen rearing upper box I often just use a frame of drawn comb sprinkled liberally with pollen (by which I mean a few tablespoons full of the stuff) facing the grafted queens. It all goes …

What about this stuff on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Natural-Bee-Pollen-Granules-Natures-Complete-Food-Harvested-From-Spain-/111667909987?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item19ffed1563) … which appears to be collected by a very hoverfly-looking bee ;)

I am going to try my first grafts of the season this weekend so will pop some pollen in the upper box as you describe FS :)

I even prepared and got some lovely paintbrushes as described on some blog ;)

[chris]

What about this stuff on eBay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Natural-Bee-Pollen-Granules-Natures-Complete-Food-Harvested-From-Spain-/111667909987?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item19ffed1563) …

The page won't open here because of "legal restrictions in certain countries" !!!!!!!!

Apparently pollen can be taken on a regular basis to help prevent prostate problems. Considering the general age of beekeepers.................

[fatshark]

I even prepared and got some lovely paintbrushes as described on some blog ;)

You don't want to go believing everything you read on the web young man ;)

Got back from Fife late last night where I left hundreds of scouts exploring my bait hive … here's hoping I've got a result when I return. My first grafts of the year have just gone into nucs for mating … the latest I've started for four or five years I reckon.

[fatshark]

The page won't open here because of "legal restrictions in certain countries" !!!!!!!!

Here's the image from the eBay item … do these weird Spanish bees get into France as well Chris?

2286

[fatshark]

Jackson Pollock(s) … spent the morning enthusiastically painting poly nucs with my new HVLP spray gun. So enthusiastic on the first coat that I forgot to put a sheet down first to catch the overspray …

2291

… which, since I'm red/green colourblind, looks just fine ;) A marked improvement on using a brush - a dozen poly nucs, floors, bodies and roofs - in an hour or so per coat. Once I'd worked out how much to thin the paint. And only about two hours to clean up afterwards :(

2292

[Bridget]

So happy to find my bees have managed to put honey into the supers that went on last Sarurday. Now I don't have to worry if they have enough stores. Some of it even capped. Not got a clue what nectar they are finding. Temps averaging around 10 this week with the odd fluctuation up to 14 but snow on the hills above overnight. Damn fine bees I'd say. Scottish born and bred!


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[Neils]

Well, I started May with a sad little Nuc and a queenless national hive and start June with a laying queen in the national, the sad little nuc starting to come along and have been busy collecting waif and stray swarms as people run out of kit. I may technically be up to 5 colonies (with another 3/4 still to come) but between the lot of them I think I could just about muster one decent colony to bring in some honey.

I"m going to get the others up to the apiary, give them all until mid June to settle down and then look to see if I can reduce them down to 2-3 nice strong colonies with maybe a couple of Nucs to take into winter. There is hope for this season yet!

[deanrpwaacs]

That reminds me of a young lad i knew who decided to spray paint his car parts black on the cream front room carpet 😀 . And he wanted to be a fighter pilot !

[chris]

When I chose this place, one of the reasons was the 2 alleys of limes, 18 in all, plus others around the grounds.
Today:
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About 2 weeks earlier than up t'mountain :D

[fatshark]

Well done Chris … I've just discovered a 'tree/woodland consultant' who appears to know of every lime tree in the county. Could prove useful ;)
Today's news is that my first attempt with a Cloake board appears to be working well. Big fat cells that will be sealed tomorrow.

[Neils]

Now up to 7 hives, including two nucs. Biggest Is Currently about 5-6 frames so this weekend I'm going to look to combine 4 of them down to two to try and get some honey coming in. There are still two colonies that need moving including one for my next door neighbour who's just starting out. They have the brood side of an AS but it currently not queen right so may need a spare queen which I'll have once I've combined a couple of colonies.
After a disastrous start to the year things are looking up as I've also managed to secure two more sites including one ideal for my currently non existent queen rearing programme.

[Calum]

Stuck at a supplier in Vienna - with a machine that just will not run without variation of every sort.
The wife tells me that the two 3 frame nucs in the garden are bringing in pollen, so it looks like they accepted the queens i gave them on Sunday.
Thats me up to 20 colonies with laying queens - from 4 after my spring sell off.
My trainee beek is preparing apideas for the 30 queens we are sending to the breeding station....
And I am stuck 700km away until Saturday... not sure what my target of overwintered colonies should be - i guess i will run out of boxes to put them in at some point!
Here the first honey harvest is blighted with melicitose...

[gavin]

Good to learn that things are getting back on track Neil.


Well done Chris … I've just discovered a 'tree/woodland consultant' who appears to know of every lime tree in the county. Could prove useful ;)


Pah! I have them all covered ..... if you're talking Fife of course ..... :p

[Neils]

And I'm off tonight to sort out the other site which is on 15 acres of meadow/orchard. They are so keen to have bees there they came round last night to find out when I could move some there.

I've also has another offer from an organic farm down the road, but I'm saving that one for later. Right now a couple of apiaries with s few hives on each seems to make more sense than rushing in and having to spend ages driving around to look at a hive here or there.

[Neils]

Moving kit around to set up the new apiary:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8851/18586684720_9b1618e120_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ujrBPo)

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8872/18774481415_79327642d3_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/uB38er)

I think the bees will be happy here, loads of clover in the fields which aren't mown until August.

I've got a couple of hives being combined at the moment which I'll move tomorrow. I'll bring one and probably a backup nuc up to get this one going, but plenty of room to expand.

[HJBee]

Had what is my first real hard work day with the bees today, one of my larger colonies was bubbling last week so I did a split and encourage some bees in a polynucleotide to draw me a new queen, which they've done beautifully.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/18/55e40622dd78833235e516a1e44154e6.jpg
But the main colony was still bubbling today and had started to draw & charge swarm cells, as well as fill 2 supers. Great - I had the day off to go back & read up on A/S with & without finding the Queen. Bad that it was cold, drizzly & a touch windy - not ideal, but at RHS tomorrow & busy all Sat, so it had to be done. Went back fully equipped with kit & syrup and a) managed to find the queen and b) managed to not get stung once (and they weren't happy). So where there was one, now are three (fingers crossed).
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/18/2c585eb76066a2e9bee1285e607ae7c4.jpg

[GRIZZLY]

I've had a "ghost" swarm today, Went thro the colony with John Smith the local bee inspector - they were on double brood and contained seventeen frames of brood and eggs, No sign of queen cells at all. The queen had been marked last year and so was easily seen and found. They were shut up again and left to their own devices ., they had 3 supers on top by the way. That evening this colony threw a large swarm which settled on a cross bar on a fence about 6 feet up in the air. I decided we must have missed a queen cell after all. I went to my bee shed to collect my swarm box + board and cover cloth . On my return I found the swarm had absconded -not into the parent hive but completely away. I wasn't away for more than 5 minutes fetching my gear. I've no idea where they've gone or why they went so quickly. a bit of a mystery.

[greengumbo]

Well that was fun. Got a call from my wife to say the bees in the garden were "going bloody mental". Went home and found it had settled down and thre was a small swarm sitting next to the car in a gorse bush. Popped it into a paynes poly nuc and left it under the branches with nasonovs on full display at the entrance. Went back indoors to congratulate myself and have lunch then came out ten mins later to notice a second swarm about 10m away in gorse so have popped that into a decrepit old WBC hive I had kicking about.

The thing is these are undoubtedly from a nucleus hive I split of a large colony a few weeks back. I had left 2 QCs in it but must have missed one more. I reckon these are casts. What would you recommend. Finding the virgins in the cast and killing them then adding the bees back to parent nuc OR chopping 1 virgin and combining the 2 casts ?

[fatshark]

Depending on time and enthusiasm available I'd also consider just chucking the two casts in together and seeing what develops … assuming you want another colony. Finding and culling the virgins might be a bit of a palaver.

[greengumbo]

Depending on time and enthusiasm available I'd also consider just chucking the two casts in together and seeing what develops … assuming you want another colony. Finding and culling the virgins might be a bit of a palaver.

This is what I'm going to do. Might even grab a frame of brood from another overly strong hive and stick it in with them in one big melee.

[The Drone Ranger]

the swarming urge seems to be strong this month maybe the weather pattern
Normally if they were hatching together you might expect them to fight it out ?

On a slight tangent quite a lot of the bees from my 2014 queens are producing yellow bums
The queens are dark themselves and the odd thing is last season with the 2013 queens there wasn't much other than a small smattering of yellow workers
Wondered if that might be down to more Italian imports but the matings would have been spread though the Season of 2014
Hey! ho! at least they are all well behaved apart from two which manned by nut jobs :)

[The Drone Ranger]

G.G.
Would a Marburg box help to combine swarms ?

[greengumbo]

G.G.
Would a Marburg box help to combine swarms ?

Just googled this and its a cool piece of kit ! Cheers for the advice :)

Bit late for now as this dark and murky morning I went out and chucked both casts into the same nuc and sealed it up. Will move it to another apiary and feed a bit and then forget about it for a month :)

[HJBee]

Had a great beekeeping day yesterday. Went through my hives and made sure all is well. The big hive is starting to seal the 2 supers of honey, even while waiting for their new queen to hatch. I found this fellow under the roof - Violet Ground Beetle - Carabus violaceus, very handsome.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/27/6896055c59b4482cd0df593698e20ce3.jpg
Then got a call from one of my beekeeping friends to say she thought her (currently queenless) bees were swarming. Nope her hive was pretty much as we'd left it in Thurs nights inspection, full of bees & sealed Q/C. So we had another persons bees swarm to her garden. After knocking the bulk into a skep, and seeing the lovely Unmarked/Unclipped queen scurry to the bottom, they happily settled there. We then transferred them to a hive in the evening.http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/27/4dfd85ac0b41fa7d9ff95be978a51e55.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/27/72d3a9df9e7e6623fbd0688b5e164198.jpg

[fatshark]

Flight back from Edinburgh delayed so it was a really rush job in the apiaries this evening … finding mated queens, marking mated queens, dropping a mated queen (D'oh!) and failing to find or catch mated queens. I saw some of these as virgins a few days ago and it always amazes me how they plump up and get going.

Being red/green colour blind I only mark with blue and white pens. I've only just realised that this is a 'blue' year and I've marked everything so far white. Perhaps that should be in the confessions thread.

Checked out a new apiary site on Friday and came across loads of these orchids … any ideas? Early purple perhaps? Eastern Fife. Appalling camera phone image, apologies.

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[HJBee]

Don't know, but it's beautiful!

[gavin]

That's a Northern Marsh Orchid, Dactlyorhiza purpurella. You'll find it in Wales, Norn Iron, the Northern half of England and northwards. Almost worth moving north for :-) There are currently three finishing off their flowering just in front of the hives at my long-term site.

This is the peak time for orchids. Must see if I can find the time to take a day off and visit my favourite SWT reserve in highland Perthshire which boasts 8 different orchid species.

Another batch of grafts set up today.

[Adam]

Well that was fun. Got a call from my wife to say the bees in the garden were "going bloody mental". Went home and found it had settled down and thre was a small swarm sitting next to the car in a gorse bush. Popped it into a paynes poly nuc and left it under the branches with nasonovs on full display at the entrance. Went back indoors to congratulate myself and have lunch then came out ten mins later to notice a second swarm about 10m away in gorse so have popped that into a decrepit old WBC hive I had kicking about.

The thing is these are undoubtedly from a nucleus hive I split of a large colony a few weeks back. I had left 2 QCs in it but must have missed one more. I reckon these are casts. What would you recommend. Finding the virgins in the cast and killing them then adding the bees back to parent nuc OR chopping 1 virgin and combining the 2 casts ?
If you remove any queencells in the hive and put the swarms back in, they shouldn't swarm again and the queens will fight it out.

[HJBee]

Why do bees swarm with Virgin queens, surely a risky strategy, she might not come back from a mating flight? Also if she keeps going out, how do they know not to follow her? Why doesn't she kill off the remaining queens in cells, is this usual or unusual?

[busybeephilip]

Virgin warming - maybe AVM on a larger scale?
When she gets older she gets wiser and faster...
Sometimes she does kill the other queens/cells if weather gets bad

Good questions, wish I knew the answers, I'm sure someone knows.

[fatshark]

Quick inspection of a hive which should have had a new laying queen present … very gently smoked them, lifted off the supers and crownboard and was pleased to find a frame or so of eggs and larvae just where they should have been. All looking good. Somewhat less pleased to find a big clump of workers busily balling the queen on the next frame :mad: Gently pushing them about with my fingers failed to dissuade them. Gave them a waft of smoke to disperse them and the queen ambled off apparently none the worse for wear. We'll see ...

The bees know best.

Sometimes.

[HJBee]

Tonight helped home a swarm which seems to be a cast of a re-homed swarm from Saturday? The dafties had filled the only drawn frame with nectar / sugar syrup - maybe the new queen was too impatient for comb to be drawn and did one? But why would any of the workers stay. New swarm is sealed I'd with a queen excluder underneath this time.

[Jon]

fatshark - some colonies I have had ball the queen like that every time they are opened as a protection thing.
I don't have any like that at the moment but I had one that did it every time and I was always surprised to seethe queen alive and well and being balled at the next inspection.

[fatshark]

Well it was a new one to me Jon … interesting. They didn't look to be protecting her. More like mauling her. As I said, she's a relatively new Q raised in the hive … the workers will therefore be from her mother. They didn't show this before. They were really reluctant to let go when I pushed and prodded them. I'm going back into the colony tomorrow so it'll be interesting if they do it again.

Or if I have some one day old queen cells being drawn :(

Update Couldn't see her, but no obvious queens cells either. However, the car thermometer told me it's 32 centigrade here on the way to the apiary and I was sweating like a piggy, so didn't exactly look hard for her.

[The Drone Ranger]

Todays news is I watched a swarm take off from the top of a willow tree and disappear
Yesterday I was out all day so it probably clustered then
Still haven't figured out which hive it has come from

I took an educated and optimistic guess it might be No 25 hive which is headed up by the Freddy Kruger of queen bees
Needless to say I was half way through checking when the skies opened up and I got soaked to boot
She is still there unfortunately but by the time I established that, half the bees in the hive were bouncing off me
At one point I swear the drones were joining in as well
If I had taken a few more minutes her majesty would have been leading the attack like Napoleon
Anyway wet, sweat and stung 3 times on finger
Not a happy bunny

[fatshark]

DR, under those conditions I might have taken the opportunity of hastening her demise …

I opened a colony last year in a full-on thunderstorm, with heavy rain, lightning and drum-rolls of thunder. The bees were of Scottish stock from Colonsay. They stuck to the frames like glue, didn't budge and were completely docile. I was soaked and hugely relieved.

[HJBee]

Tonight we wandered past a series of Laurel bushes on our evening stroll, it was alive with honeybees, but I'm at a loss as to why? Anyone shed any thoughts? They had their proboscis out dabbing on the leaves & stems.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/01/25ab85eee0d10b6baae4c7bfd59786d8.jpg

[Bridget]

Don't know the answer to that but does anyone know what this shrub is? In my years working in Livingston I've never seen a bee on any of the shrubs or trees but today this was covered in honey bees and bumbles
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/01/b0530717fafacfeb0450b2a3410f7694.jpg


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[fatshark]

The bees on the laurel are going for the extrafloral nectaries … I think they're on the younger leaves.

[alancooper]

Don't know the answer to that but does anyone know what this shrub is? In my years working in Livingston I've never seen a bee on any of the shrubs or trees but today this was covered in honey bees and bumbles
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/01/b0530717fafacfeb0450b2a3410f7694.jpg


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It looks like a Hebe.

[Bridget]

Could be but I'm used to Hebd being small ( probably stunted by the highland winds) and this was probably 3 ft high. Hard to tell how wide as possibly many plants.


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[HJBee]

It looks like a Hebe.

It is a Hebe

[HJBee]

The bees on the laurel are going for the extrafloral nectaries … I think they're on the younger leaves.

Thanks FS!

[GRIZZLY]

My bees are working the extrafloral nectaries on my broad bean plants and also those on the leaf bases of our cherry trees. Quite a few books refer to these and its interesting finding the sites on various plants and seeing the bees on them.

[alancooper]

I have often noticed my bees on patches of non-flowering lamb's lettuce in my veg patch and also in short-grazed non-flowering specie-rich meadow - and assumed they were after water. Does anyone know if there is a list of plants with extra-floral nectaries somewhere?

[chris]

To avoid confusion in my mind (or what of it still functions) is this something completely different to the bees feeding off the secretions of aphids etc. ?

[Adam]

Does anyone know if there is a list of plants with extra-floral nectaries somewhere?

BBKA Module 2 asks about such things. Beans and Cherry Laurel are two of the plants. Plum and Cherry are two others. there are not many that exhibit this characteristic.

[chris]

To avoid confusion in my mind (or what of it still functions) is this something completely different to the bees feeding off the secretions of aphids etc. ?

A quick search has educated me. Found this site interesting


http://www.wbrc.org.uk/WORCRECD/32/Winnall_Rosemary--Ants_and_Extra-floral_.html

[HJBee]

[QUOTE=chris;30698]A quick search has educated me. Found this site interesting
/QUOTE]

Very interesting indeed

[The Drone Ranger]

DR, under those conditions I might have taken the opportunity of hastening her demise …

I opened a colony last year in a full-on thunderstorm, with heavy rain, lightning and drum-rolls of thunder. The bees were of Scottish stock from Colonsay. They stuck to the frames like glue, didn't budge and were completely docile. I was soaked and hugely relieved.
Most of them are Ok but 2 for some reason are horrible.
They are on the requeening list.
I 'borrowed' one of Jon's queens from a friend I think she is expecting it back.
Really nice bees
I holding on to her

[lindsay s]

Hi all because I’ve been very busy for the last six weeks this forum has taken a back seat, but I’m still out there trying to keep on top of my beekeeping. The weather in June was worse than Mays with twice the average rainfall and well below average temperatures and sunshine. Orkneys colonies are now reaching their peak but up until the weekend there was very little forage coming in. The warm weather in the last few days has improved things greatly. The clover, although late, is now coming out and if we get a nice July and August all might not be lost.
Swarming has just started up here and on Thursday while paying a quick visit to my friend’s apiary I came across this prime swarm about midday. I knew she was away till late and I had to deal with it so I rushed home and came back about 40 minutes later with a nuc plus all the other paraphernalia needed to deal with the swarm.
Now here’s where I should be bragging about my textbook swarm collection and impressing all you beginners out there but things didn’t go quite to plan. Firstly I managed to brush about 90% of the bees off the tree trunk and into a cardboard box which I then dumped on the sheet in front of the nuc. The idea was for the bees to happily trundle into the nuc but they were having none of it and after about 10 minutes a cluster started to gather on a shrub nearby. I left them for about half an hour to settle before dumping them in front of the nuc for a second time. This time the bees decided to enter the nuc with a little bit of help from me and by the time I came back with some syrup nearly all of the bees were inside( I lifted the crown board to check). Before I left about 4 pm I contacted my friend and told her how pleased I was with the way things worked out.
The next morning my friend was contacted by a neighbour who said a swarm had arrived in their garden about teatime the previous day. Basically the swarm scoffed all the syrup I fed them and then left the nuc to spend all night on a shrub in the pouring rain. They have since been rehoused in another hive and moved to a slightly different location. With hindsight I think the nuc was a bit too small for the size of swarm but everything’s worked out fine in the end.

[Mellifera Crofter]

RIP Queen Whitebeam (2011-2015). When I saw her last week I reluctantly followed advice and stopped trying to save her. I found her this afternoon dead in front of the hive. I think a new queen has just started laying - a few eggs are placed a bit skew-whiff.

2335

Apart from that, is anybody else also bothered by midgies while checking your colonies? If I'm not complaining about the wind here on my hill, it's the midgies. I think I'll have to get a bee suit with with midgie netting rather than bee netting.
Kitta

[fatshark]

That's a pretty good innings these days … I 'retired' an old girl today who had also provided excellent service but was very clearly failing. I don't name mine (numbering the colonies is as personal as it gets) … why was she called 'Whitebeam'?

[Mellifera Crofter]

I choose a name to remind me of where they emerged, or something else specific to that queen. I have a queen Bell (from Belfast), a Queen Joan ( Jon) and a Queen Ranger.

[Bridget]

I'm standing in my bee house about to start an inspection. One hive is very full of bees so need to add another super. It's very quiet in here except for the sound of thousands of bees working their little socks off. Sounds like the patter of tiny raindrops. However these bees are a bit fierce and intimidating so it's double if not treble layers all over and one hive today and another tomorrow. With the thick gloves I was finding it really hard to get a grip on the frames so last time tried a hinged frame holder which meant I could be a lot gentler and quicker. Was hoping to try Gavin's BB lift but my frames are not the right way for that and being inside I can't get at them from the sides.


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[fatshark]

Extraction today … quite a few mixed frames of OSR and whatever followed it. Having spent the last few hours clinging onto the extractor I don't know why this bloke is smiling so much …

2336

[Bridget]

So there I was on Sunday tra-lalling about the patter of little bee feet etc. etc

I'm standing in my bee house about to start an inspection. One hive is very full of bees so need to add another super. It's very quiet in here except for the sound of thousands of bees working their little socks off. Sounds like the patter of tiny raindrops. However these bees are a bit fierce and intimidating so it's double if not treble layers all over and one hive today and another tomorrow. With the thick gloves I was finding it really hard to get a grip on the frames so last time tried a hinged frame holder which meant I could be a lot gentler and quicker.

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Following my now good advice to our local association I waited until my husband returned and then weighed in. Amidst the raging kerfuffle of my horrid bees I was just exclaiming to my self about the 95% capped brood frame on the second frame in when smoker went out. As I was trying to relight it i realised too much tra-lalling had resulted in lack of concentration and I had two stings under the chin. Retreat called, off with all the layers and very quickly felt unwell. NHS 24 called (don't do this folks, just ring 999) and after being ill all over the bedroom the boys in green arrived and set about sorting me out. Blood pressure in my boots, which they failed to sort out so off to Raigmore it was, but nothing fancy like blue light. When I got there I was recovering and told I wasn't interesting enough for RESUS, where they were all waiting, so into A&E. Kept in over night given stuff for BP and out all OK the next day if a little shaky. A&E doc said it might be a conflict with a beta blocker that caused the sudden drop, and they gave me a couple of EPI pens, but was not told to give up beekeeping for good.
So the plan, and I would be grateful for any input here, is to turn beekeeping for this season over to my husband and some local friend beeks to help him. , There has been no sign recently of any swarming and both queens were late last summer supercedures, plenty of space with two brood boxes and 2 supers on each and masses of forage around here and the heather in under a month. So we will let them get on with it - they are so foul and if they do swarm they won't be missed.
Just before the heather is out we will take off any sealed blossom honey and give them back the wet frames to fill, along with the remaining super, with heather honey. End of September take off heather honey, do varroa control feed etc etc.
Meanwhile I have two gentle queens being raised in Drumgerry's apiary, the intention was to re-queen these hives with some of his lovely genes (well his bees genes, not his). I will bring them back here when its time for them to go into nucs and over winter them here. In spring kill off the grumpy queens and combine. Does this seem like a plan. I thought of killing off the queens in the autumn but this way I'll have a chance of getting more colonies through the winter.
I'm also going to ask my GP for a test to see how allergic I am. Meanwhile I will try not to go anywhere near them, but I miss the daily checking of what they are up to. :( Its a great shame as they have been such prolific bees and flying in all but the wet, through the cold and cloudy.
Onwards and upwards
Bridget

[The Drone Ranger]

are you using a full bee suit Bridget ?
All in one I mean
When I wear a jacket and separate trousers they often get in

[Bridget]

If you could see me dressed and ready to go Drone Ranger, you would laugh - every precaution including three layers including the full bee suit. My fault, I forgot to double check the velcro under my chin

[Mellifera Crofter]

...My fault, I forgot to double check the velcro under my chin
Big mistake - and one I make so often. In fact, I just forget to completely zip up my hood, and then find a bee in my bonnet. Fortunately I've never had an experience like yours. I hope you can get back to the bees soon.
Kitta

[fatshark]

I'd be tempted to requeen them sooner rather than later Bridget. But that's because I value the pleasure I get from beekeeping a bit more than the honey I get from beekeeping. Not sure I fully understand the "getting more colonies through the winter" comment … surely it's 2 (horrid colonies) + 2 (nucs with dg's genes) or just 2 requeened colonies? Although they'd probably be easier to requeen in the spring that's a long time away to be spent (having others) dealing with unpleasant colonies. I presume nucs overwinter well in your bee house?

[gavin]

Sorry to hear that. Definitely see your GP. There is a test called a RAST test, or at least there was when I went through this some years ago. It gave a 1-5 rating which lead on to a desensitisation course in my case.

[HJBee]

Sorry to hear that. Definitely see your GP. There is a test called a RAST test, or at least there was when I went through this some years ago. It gave a 1-5 rating which lead on to a desensitisation course in my case.

Same with me, I've finished my extensive weekly venom jags recently & now on the monthly ones for the next 2 years. Apart from the start in the winter months, I've been at the bees without a break. I take a daily Fexofenadine 180mg tablet and carry an epi pen, double layer incl gloves (blue nitrile over leather). I was stung last week (right after my monthly jag) survived and although still a large red & itchy patch developed gradually over the 24 hours to peak the next day (this is a unique thing according to the clinicians I'm under), but it's no where as bad as what I was experiencing last year. My fault, I was too busy gabbing that I didn't zip my veil. However, it's a personal choice I'm lucky I have no other ailments, if I did or had full anaphylaxis I may of decided otherwise. H

[Bridget]

Sorry to hear that. Definitely see your GP. There is a test called a RAST test, or at least there was when I went through this some years ago. It gave a 1-5 rating which lead on to a desensitisation course in my case.

Yes Gavin I will. This link provides some useful information about a new campaign to help people with allergies to bees.
http://beeresistant.com/



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[Bridget]

I'd be tempted to requeen them sooner rather than later Bridget. But that's because I value the pleasure I get from beekeeping a bit more than the honey I get from beekeeping. Not sure I fully understand the "getting more colonies through the winter" comment … surely it's 2 (horrid colonies) + 2 (nucs with dg's genes) or just 2 requeened colonies? Although they'd probably be easier to requeen in the spring that's a long time away to be spent (having others) dealing with unpleasant colonies. I presume nucs overwinter well in your bee house?

Well I really do like honey Fatshark.....but one queen is not marked and will be really hard to find at present what with all their tempers. I don't think it fair to ask some else to work with these bees at present. By the time the brood has dwindled sufficiently and the heather stopped ( and we have three weeks away in Septemer) it will be early October and I am presuming that is too late to re queen. I over wintered a queen last year in the bee house. Mind you, when it comes to making up the nucs if they were better behaved we could try with the marked queen colony.



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[fatshark]

I've no experience with late requeening i.e. after September, so perhaps your plan is the best. Certainly finding an unmarked Q in a box of psychos is not for the faint hearted and not something you can fairly ask someone else to do (though many of those on here who raise queens will have been asked by others to do this - I know I have).

[Feckless Drone]

....but one queen is not marked and will be really hard to find at present what with all their tempers.

Oh Bridget - that Q needs dealt with her. I've been there after a particular Q was ruining my beekeeping. After being beaten back a couple of times I eventually dealt with her. I let the problem drift but never again - here's a suggestion based on ideas from others for a strategy that helped me. On a really good day, take the bees out of the beehouse some distance away but leave some frames/super in place, (flyers will off, return and reduce numbers) then split whats left into two (thats what I did) or three nuc boxes. Wait 15 minutes and listen (you might not need 15 mins). The quiet box will have the Q. Now you are looking for a Q in a nuc. I use a damp towel to cover frames not being looked at. What you do with her depends on what you have available. I was lucky in that I had access to a replacement Q (Thanks Gav) but the potential for a rogue colony is one reason I try to ensure I've always got a backup Q on site. I'm sure someone would be willing to help - how about a beginner who needs to learn about finding Qs (and of how nasty a colony can be)?

[The Drone Ranger]

If you could see me dressed and ready to go Drone Ranger, you would laugh - every precaution including three layers including the full bee suit. My fault, I forgot to double check the velcro under my chin

Hi Bridget
I would attempt the requeen now because if it doesn't go to plan there is just time to do it again
Almost all commercially produced queens are to be guaranteed to produce gentle bees
Luckily you have a couple of queens already on hand thanks to Drumgerry
Things will start getting better right away after the requeen and 6 weeks later everything Hunky Dory
A possible way is take the original hive off to the side and after a few hours lift the combs out one at a time and move each one to a spare box until the crazy queens are found

Its tempting to leave it as is but I have always regretted that in the past
I sometimes have to relearn that lesson but it's always a mistake to leave I am certain
Martha Carnie (sic) did it on the TV last year while I shouted NO! NO! NO! at the screen lol!

Feckless drone has a better suggestion if you have the equipment
I'm slow typing

[gavin]

Where's the SBAi 'Like' button?!

Keep one of those nucs you've just created and slip in that queen in a cage you organised in advance. Then what? Various options. Reconstruct the monster and go through it again in a week (when it will be in a *really* bad mood) to remove queen cells. Mark and clip the original queen and return her to the original site for a week with all the bees except the nuc with the new queen and remove the old queen 6 hours before combining. Maybe return one frame of brood to the original site (makes it easy to deal with the queen cells there) and keep the rest in nuc boxes until the new queen has settled for a week and can be combined with all the rest (after removing queen cells). Life is full of choices!

Bear in mind that these bad-tempered colonies often calm down again (to some extent) when the nectar gets flowing again.

[The Drone Ranger]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nagC41Pe4c4
my final word :)

[mbc]

Where's the SBAi 'Like' button?!
.

Green and red rep is always amusing on forums.

[Bridget]

Thanks to you all for your help and thoughts. Poor Drumgerry has drawn the short straw to give us a hand - some of it sounds a bit complicated, I think I will need a flowchart to see how it all works, and I will get together some helpers as well and the queens will be found and dispatched henceforth.
We will let you know!

[fatshark]

Oh Bridget - that Q needs dealt with her. [snip] I'm sure someone would be willing to help - how about a beginner who needs to learn about finding Qs (and of how nasty a colony can be)?

How did I miss this fantastic suggestion the first time round? ;)

[Emma]

Yesterday, the sound I'd been waiting for:
the cathedral choir of foragers, humming in the vault of limes.
Best sound of the year :-) :-) :-)
...then the rain started again. Same again this morning :-(
Oh well, at least it won't be too dry for the nectar to flow!

[Mellifera Crofter]

My colonies at the croft are chucking out drone larvae, and even the occasional drone. I think they've been terribly hive-bound lately - perhaps that's the reason.
Kitta

[Feckless Drone]

Rained off inspections yesterday - but did see that colonies had more stores three weeks ago than now, and that's not much. Looks like my Qs have really cut down on laying so going to be a miserable crop for me.
Comment for Fatshark - leave half your supers down south, you will not need them up here!

[GRIZZLY]

Bridget if push really comes to shove you can always find the queen by filtering all the bees thro' a q excluder over an empty box, using another box over the top as a funnel. You shake each frame of bees into the top box when they will run down to the bottom box. When you've done say three frames these can be placed down into the bottom box which encourages the bees to run down.you check the top of the queen excluder and eventually you wil find the q trapped on top to squish as neccessary. This method is quite disruptive to the bees so should be used as a last resort. Ive used this method with success at this time of year when colonies get so huge and queens are unmarked and impossible to find. Hope this helps. Sorry to hear you've become alergic - could this have started on colonsay ?.

[The Drone Ranger]

My colonies at the croft are chucking out drone larvae, and even the occasional drone. I think they've been terribly hive-bound lately - perhaps that's the reason.
Kitta

How are they for stores Kitta ?

[Mellifera Crofter]

How are they for stores Kitta ?
They were fine, DR, and strong colonies. Two of the more vigorous chucker-outers were my AMM queens. Perhaps it's instinct! They know about our weather.

I did not see the same thing at my more sheltered out-apiary, although it's more difficult to spot it there as only a few have landing spaces in front of their hives. But I did see a few bees biting some poor drones' legs.

However, they are all tucking into their capped honey.

I should have said 'pupae'! Tisk tisk.

[The Drone Ranger]

Its always worrying when you see them chuck out some of the brood
Who would be a drone given the choice :)

Robbing to look forward to next
I had to use a cover cloth over my paynes nucs when marking the new queens because of other bees trying to get in

7 new queens marked yesterday and two were replacing key members of the wild bunch (vicious hives )
I gave them a long time since the last inspection to let the new queens replace most of the old aggressive bees (there were 3 hives)
The third member of the gang should have had their new queen marked as well but instead there were 4 frames of solid brood and two queen cells smack in the middle of the comb
Couldn't spot her and it looks like she is being superceded so I just left the cells alone
Nice temperament now so I hope the replacement carries on the good work

[prakel]

First rain (worth the title) of the summer. If only we'd had it a month ago...

Spent yesterday's rather nicer afternoon driving bees from some 'experimental' (didn't have enough frames to hand when they were made up) mating hives of approx mp size. Interesting experience -and a surprisingly simple job too.

The bee-less brood comb was then cut out, fixed into new frames and returned to the bees.

[The Drone Ranger]

Went through a few hives today between about 4.30 and 5.30
One had a queen to be marked and typically I couldn't find her
The bees were ok and so I didnt use smoke
After a while gave up and closed the hive at which point a number of deranged bees started an all out attack on my mobile phone case
They were stinging the lining of it in droves.
If the thing had been alive it wouldn't have been dead now
Reached for the smoker -- gone out as usual -- into pocket for matches -- left them in bee shed
The spirit of Chucky has taken hold of these idiot bees so now I leave the phone where it is and trudge back for matches
Smoker going full blast I drive them off and hide the phone (android) --- they may be Apple fans.

On to the next one
This is a Nuc with another unmarked queen
I get the pooter, the marking cage, and the pen ready
The lid of the pen is stiff so I take it off first
Queen spotted --- caught in pooter-- about to put in marking cage
No!!! knocked the pen lid into the feed slot of the Paynes nuc
Its too deep for hive tool so it's off to a nearby tree for a long twig
Now I'm standing there like chimpanzee with a stick looking for bugs
Cant get the thing out!
Back for a second long twig --- finally the lid of the pen accepts defeat and comes back up.
Ok now I mark the queen-- after which she wont come out of the cage and when she does she goes right on the frame edge waiting to be squashed
I give her a gentle poke --- instead of moving she falls to the bottom of the nuc

Right that's it ---tools away--- enough beekeeping for one afternoon -- grrr....

[fatshark]

Right that's it ---tools away--- enough beekeeping for one afternoon -- grrr....

We have a confessions thread for stuff like this ;)

Is the phone case black by any chance? I regularly have a small black camera with me and the bees quite often take a disliking to it. Even when stood innocuously on a hive roof (the camera, not me) they still give it hell.

[The Drone Ranger]

We have a confessions thread for stuff like this ;)

Is the phone case black by any chance? I regularly have a small black camera with me and the bees quite often take a disliking to it. Even when stood innocuously on a hive roof (the camera, not me) they still give it hell.

Yes Black :)

This is just normal beekeeping at the moment I will save the confessions for when something really goes wrong :)

[gavin]

I was also doing some early evening beekeeping tonight, and trying to mark and clip queens. Three escaped my grasp. One disappeared down behind the hive into the depths of two pallets, another made a bid for freedom *after* I'd clipped a wing and I saw a quick spiral but didn't know if it had made it into the hive or not. One leapt and fell on the top bars and I just left it.

I'd been waiting for the queens to 'settle in' but have been lured into a false sense of security by a slight improvement in temper in the last couple of days. Nah, month old queens are too early, at least with this feisty ex-Moidart stock.

Also feeding nucs some of which are critically low on stores in the midst of plenty (including a half-decent lime flow).

By the time I was done the hive entrances had all settled down. I reckon they all made it back home.

PS My current notebook pen is grey with black bits at the tip. They really don't like the tip of that pen. Probably it is reminiscent of the eye of some creature intent on robbing the hive.

[Bridget]

Thanks Grizzly. I'm lucky that Fraser has been happy to step up to head beekeeper rather than loose the bees. And Drumgerry is going to help with the re queening. Hopefully I can get the desensitisation and be back next year. Meanwhile my horrible bees have been good as gold for Fraser and we have just taken off a super of honey. No I don't think this like Colonsay. I've never before been allergic to anything, but always had a localised reaction to bee, cleg, mosquito and other insect bites or stings.


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[The Drone Ranger]

"'I'd been waiting for the queens to 'settle in' but have been lured into a false sense of security by a slight improvement in temper in the last couple of days"

When will they invent a beesuit that stops them getting through Gavin thats what I wan't to know :)

[Kate Atchley]

I was also doing some early evening beekeeping tonight, and trying to mark and clip queens. Three escaped my grasp. One disappeared down behind the hive into the depths of two pallets, another made a bid for freedom *after* I'd clipped a wing and I saw a quick spiral but didn't know if it had made it into the hive or not. One leapt and fell on the top bars and I just left it.

I'd been waiting for the queens to 'settle in' but have been lured into a false sense of security by a slight improvement in temper in the last couple of days. Nah, month old queens are too early, at least with this feisty ex-Moidart stock.

Do pop over to Moidart Gavin, to see how it's done!

Marked and clipped a few queens yesterday and thankfully none escaped though did they wriggle. One's a "runner" and I had a job catching her but laying brilliantly. Posting first queens on Monday ... do I mark the envelope?

Oh, and failed mating from mini-nucs without brood: how long to leave the bees queenless or is it best to unite? They'll be ageing.

[prakel]

failed mating from mini-nucs without brood: how long to leave the bees queenless or is it best to unite? They'll be ageing.

I unite and then re-divide as required. Reckon a fresh start is a far better use of resources than trying to fix a failure.

[Kate Atchley]

I unite and then re-divide as required. Reckon a fresh start is a far better use of resources than trying to fix a failure.

Thanks Prakel ... curious how much is written about setting up mating nucs and how little detail is offered about managing them. I found the occasional helpful sentence in Oliver Field's Field Notes on Queen Rearing and Larry Connor's Queen Rearing Essentials. Any other books recommended for this?

Seems ripe for an article for The Scottish Beekeeper or BeeCraft ... maybe I'll write it to be corrected by avid experts!

[prakel]

Seems ripe for an article for he Scottish Beekeeper or BeeCraft ... maybe I'll write it to be corrected by avid experts!

Oh yes, always easier to correct someone who's made the effort to put the groundwork in than to take the plunge by outlining their own methods :).

[prakel]

curious how much is written about setting up mating nucs and how little detail is offered about managing them. I found the occasional helpful sentence in Oliver Field's Field Notes on Queen Rearing and Larry Connor's Queen Rearing Essentials. Any other books recommended for this?

The much underatted "Practical Queen Production in the North" by Carl Jurica has some unassuming comment on this stuff. Well worth a read.

[Kate Atchley]

The much underatted "Practical Queen Production in the North" by Carl Jurica has some unassuming comment on this stuff. Well worth a read.

Thanks for the suggestions. Can't find a copy ... maybe has one they'd like to sell?

[prakel]

A friend of Dr Jurica's sells them for him on ebay.com.

edit: off topic background info:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCEQFjAAahUKEwjc6trizfbGAhVF1xQKHaMyCyI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.volleyballworld.org%2Fcarl%25 20jurica%2520article.html&ei=mKyzVdy-EcWuU6PlrJAC&usg=AFQjCNFkH9nK4h8dfHD8SD9tn4x13K0a1Q&sig2=m86H8LeG_JSfLBoXQEL5sA

but it does contain this great quote:


“When I play here, I drink honey all day,” he said. “When I played semi-pro football, I’d drink two pounds of honey before every game. I was a running back and I never got tired. The alpha glucose goes right into my blood stream. I don’t use those other kinds of drinks.”

[Bridget]

When will they invent a beesuit that stops them getting through Gavin thats what I wan't to know :)

Oh I agree


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[mbc]

A friend of Dr Jurica's sells them for him on ebay.com.

edit: off topic background info:

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCEQFjAAahUKEwjc6trizfbGAhVF1xQKHaMyCyI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.volleyballworld.org%2Fcarl%25 20jurica%2520article.html&ei=mKyzVdy-EcWuU6PlrJAC&usg=AFQjCNFkH9nK4h8dfHD8SD9tn4x13K0a1Q&sig2=m86H8LeG_JSfLBoXQEL5sA

but it does contain this great quote:

Brilliant, must spread.

[gavin]

It is going to be 12C tops tomorrow, 12C!! And that is at midnight. It goes downhill from there, staying at 10C or 11C for the rest of the 24 hours. And there will be a stiff NE breeze.

Watching the forecast a week or two back caused me to hesitate getting colonies up the hills. They seem to have more chance of finding something in the sheltered lowlands even if a semi-decent lime crop is unlikely. Even better, they are not as far away and so feeding is easier. All my smaller colonies have feed on them now.

[GRIZZLY]

We seem to be getting a succession of mini flows down here. One minute no activity then a frantic dash out for a couple of hours then it all subsides again. Himalayan balsam now in full flower and is attracting swarms of bumble bees of all colours. My bees seem indifferent to it at the moment., they've obviously got a better source elsewhere. After yesterdays sunshine - its been pouring down all morning - thank heavens I managed to cut my 1 acre of lawn yesterday.

[Kate Atchley]

Weather better than forecast: around 15-16C and rain held off during long session in the apiary ... queens due from Colonsay this week and some of ours going out.

Trying a late batch of queens and, lo and behold, found eggs in 2 of the queen cups on the cell-raiser frame put there for familiarisation before grafting. Using Pasaga Ramic method so this was in bottom box, bees roaring queenless, with the queen above a Snelgrove Board. Proof of eggs moved by workers? (from a frame of mostly-capped brood which must have had an occasional egg). Replaced these with larvae and will watch with interest.

[Jon]

Kate. I see eggs in cups quite often. They are laid by workers I think. I was showing this to some of the members of our queen rearing group last Monday as a frame in a queenless colony had several eggs in the cups. This is a cell starter which has been queenless for about a month.

[fatshark]

Swarm of bees on the goalpost at Oldham Athletic footy ground (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-33668046) … cue a series of rubbish jokes ;)

[The Drone Ranger]

Oh I agree


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If Bee suits had a CE standard like motorcycle protective equipment then they would be made better and offer real protection

They all work great until the bees really want to sting you
Then you end up relying on what's underneath the thing
What's the point in that ?
Even a Primark sweatshirt underneath does a better job of keeping stings out
As for single layer fencing hoods that's just an invitation to get stung in the head
Of course we should be wearing a hat as well I suppose

The sooner either the European CE mark or some BSI standard has to be met the better
Most of them are just a cheap boiler suit with a hood on

[Kate Atchley]

Kate. I see eggs in cups quite often. They are laid by workers I think... a cell starter which has been queenless for about a month.

Jon, these bees had been separated from their queen for less than 24 hours. It seems unlikely there was a laying worker?

[prakel]

I don't think that it's that uncommon for a few laying workers to be present in queenright hives although they're kept under check by the rest of the colony -sure I've seen some research on this. This might also go some way to explaining why some strains (the ones which tolerate a few through the season) seem to go into laying worker melt-down much quicker than others -they're already there.

Of couse, I'd rather believe that you're half way to developing a line which actually does the grafting for you (might tempt me back to grafting if that was the case!).

[Kate Atchley]

Thanks Prakel. Fascinating re the laying workers.


Of course, I'd rather believe that you're half way to developing a line which actually does the grafting for you (might tempt me back to grafting if that was the case!).
Ahah! Yes I was tempted to leave those eggs and see how they developed.

[prakel]

No valid reason not to leave them... Probably a worthwhile thing to do actually. You could always cut the cells open shortly before expected emergence to see what's in them so as to save tying up mating nucs.

edit: Egg-laying, egg-removal, and ovary development by workers in queenright honey bee colonies by Ratnieks.



The study investigates whether worker policing via the selective removal of worker-laid male eggs occurs in normal honey bee colonies with a queen. Queenright honey bee colonies were set up with the queen below a queen excluder. Frames of worker brood and drone comb were placed above the queen excluder. Daily inspections of the drone frames revealed the presence of a few eggs, presumably laid by workers, at a rate of 1 egg per 16000 drone cells. 85% of these eggs were removed within 1 day and only 2% hatched. Dissections of workers revealed that about 1 worker in 10000 had a fully developed egg in her body. These data show that worker egg-laying and worker policing are both normal, though rare, in queenright honey bee colonies, and provide further confirmation of the worker policing hypothesis.

[Feckless Drone]

Swarm of bees on the goalpost at Oldham Athletic footy ground (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-33668046) … cue a series of rubbish jokes ;)

Definitely not mine! Unlike the small swarm that landed 6 feet away from my garden bait hive. I was able to check the possible source at the weekend and there was the cell I left, empty, then nearby a missed Q-cell. I promise you, looked like drone cell, apart from being bit dimpled at the end now. I opened and out waddled VQ. Guess I'll take the super off that one now. I'll try to bring on the two colonies now and see if I can get them up to strength to winter as nucs. Only crumb of comfort is that they are not the A. m. chuckii that DR is raising up in darkest Angus.

[gavin]

In case it helps, supers seem pretty much optional this season anyway!

[busybeephilip]

In case it helps, supers seem pretty much optional this season anyway!

need to give the bees somewhere to shelter from the wet, wet and more wet

[fatshark]

No consolation I'm sure but it's also utter rubbish in the Midlands as well ... I've just moved my final colony down here. It's now only drizzling after 4 days with more rain than anything else. The fields are heavy clay. My boots and the wheelbarrow are covered in cloying mud. The hive was big and very heavy, but my boots were heavier.

Horrible.

[lindsay s]

When will they invent a beesuit that stops them getting through Gavin thats what I wan't to know
Most of them are just a cheap boiler suit with a hood on :)
This not so cheap boiler suit should do the trick. I'm asking Santa for one this Christmas.;)
http://www.bjsherriff.co.uk/product/beepro-khaki/

[lindsay s]

:D
It is going to be 12C tops tomorrow, 12C!! And that is at midnight. It goes downhill from there, staying at 10C or 11C for the rest of the 24 hours. And there will be a stiff NE breeze.
Welcome to the realities of Orkney’s beekeeping. That was our weather for most of May and June. We are having a good spell up here at the moment, 14c sunny and the bees are working flat out. I dealt with a swarm today and the house holder even offered to pay me for taking it away. I’ didn’t have the cheek to accept it because unknown to him the swarm had come from my apiary.:D

[The Drone Ranger]

This not so cheap boiler suit should do the trick. I'm asking Santa for one this Christmas.;)
http://www.bjsherriff.co.uk/product/beepro-khaki/

Looks ok but what about that price ouch!
it still says
"General clothing should be worn under this suit which should not be worn on bare skin."

Tell you what Lindsay because its so wet and the grass is long I bought a pair of Lidl waterproof trousers
I have never been stung through them ( I have jeans on as well I suppose)

My theory is if the surface is slick bees can't get a grip
To sting they cling on and curve the business end round
Anything that gives them a grip like denim etc is a guarantee you will get stung
The mesh idea is good though

http://ultrabreezesuits.com/suit/order_2011.htm

[gavin]

I bought a Sherriff this spring at the Ulster Beekeepers Convention (I'll be back next year to see Tom Seeley!). It was £105 rather than >£350 and is my favourite bee suit so far by far. With a flimsier one earlier this summer I sometimes needed to put on a jumper to keep them from stinging me through suit and T-shirt. The Sherriff is just great, and the mesh much more substantial than others so I'm not worried about the odd spark from the smoker making it leaky.

[gavin]

The hive was big and very heavy, but my boots were heavier.


Sounds like you are bringing them north with plenty of stores. Wise move :).

[Mellifera Crofter]

I changed a colony from a Paynes hive to a Bee Hive Supplies hive recently. The BHS hive has a kind of porch entrance rather than a straight walk-into entrance as in a Paynes, and this is a picture of how I found them this morning. I don't know whether it means they just like sitting around outside under the shelter of the porch; or whether they feel they ought to be there to better guard the hive as the actual entrance is now a bit hidden; or whether the entrance became too congested for them all to go inside (and I should be worried). They did not do this in the Paynes.
Kitta
2349

[prakel]

Suits: aquired a Mann Lake suit (with hat and wire box veil which has always been my personal preference but they do fencing hoods too) earlier this year. Got to say that in my personal oppinion the build quality of the suit is far better than any of the others I've ever purchased in the UK -and yes, I have used both of the 'big' names and been pleased with them in the past. Knew it was going to be quality even before taking it out of the bag simply by the weight of the thing.

edit: this (http://www.mannlake.co.uk/beekeeping-supplies/category/page88.html)was the one, but they do expensive suits too for those who like to spend as much as they can :)

[Bridget]

Looks ok but what about that price ouch!
it still says
"General clothing should be worn under this suit which should not be worn on bare skin."

Tell you what Lindsay because its so wet and the grass is long I bought a pair of Lidl waterproof trousers
I have never been stung through them ( I have jeans on as well I suppose)

My theory is if the surface is slick bees can't get a grip
To sting they cling on and curve the business end round
Anything that gives them a grip like denim etc is a guarantee you will get stung
The mesh idea is good though

http://ultrabreezesuits.com/suit/order_2011.htm

Trouble both those suits have the two zips that meet below the chin, these zips can move apart and are difficult to close properly as you can't see them - this was my downfall. Has anyone tried that mega expensive one? It would be good to here a review.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Bridget]

need to give the bees somewhere to shelter from the wet, wet and more wet

This is where the bee house is good. In the winter cold it is only a couple or three degrees warmer than outside but it is never damp. I can light cardboard that's been in there for over a year. The hives are about 2 ft above the ground and protected from damp with the shed floor, the platform they sit on above the floor and their hive floor. Several local bee keepers lost colonies in the wet spring yet ours are doing well. Also the hive entrance is set back from the bee house entrance.
May be we were lucky this year of course.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Calluna4u]

As C4U suggested, I've moved the discussion on the risk of starvation to its own thread ('Starvation alert') and will leaving grafting discussion here. So the whole original post is over there. G.

You mention the Apideas, we have been having to feed them weekly now for at least a month, ditto the Kielers. The cell builders stopped doing more than a couple of cells on each graft about two weeks back, only responding better if fed continuously. Have now pulled the plug on all new grafts and cells for the season and winding the unit down for winter, a couple of weeks earlier than planned. The July queens are probably going to be problematical for mating quality and we are finding too many drone layers again, as was the case in May. Not a good season for the project, though the June queens are looking very nice.

[Jon]

I am still getting grafts started ok, about 90% in queenless starters and around 50% in queenright starters.
The last decent mating day we had here was Sunday 19th July and thankfully a lot of mine flew and mated that day.
It was 19c and sunny all afternoon but that seems like a long time ago now!
I graft a couple of batches per week and the problem is they start to back up in the apideas and the clock is ticking.
In an ideal world you put in a ripe cell which emerges the next day with mating taking place about a week later.
10-14 days after that the queen is ready to remove from the apidea.
If they take 3-4 weeks to start laying it changes all the calculations about what you can get per apidea and there will be a few drone layers as well.
I average about 2.5 per apidea but in theory you could get 4 queens per season if everything was perfect especially the weather.
That's not going to happen in NI.
June was good here, and the first few days of July.
The other problem with mini-nucs in August is the wasps especially if they have to be fed as it attracts them.

[busybeephilip]

Hi jon,

Wasps are already a problem for me, i've lost a few mini nucs to wasps already and like Calluna4u have stopped any grafting. Also noticed the wasps sniffing around the full size hives trying to get access at the entrance edges. I'm also feeding syrup to some colonies that have no supers and down sizing entrances were practical. Maybe an indian summer come September.

what worries me more is varroa, the levels are higher than this time last year and i cant treat till the supers are off, I'm considering treating with OA gas using a home made sublimox as soon as supers are off. I was quoted a ridiculous amount of Euros to obtain one of these from Italy so there is a new DIY sublimox project brewing as I type

[Jon]

I had that PHD student from NUIG at my allotment apiary 2 weeks ago and we sampled most of the colonies accurately using icing sugar to dust mites off a measured sample of 300 bees. One of the colonies dropped over 60 mites. It only had a couple of frames of sealed brood so I removed those and treated it with Oxalic trickle the next day. The rest of them will need to be treated by mid August at the latest as mite levels were generally high. I had a 3k tub of Apiguard delivered yesterday and I have Oxalic for anything broodless.

[Kate Atchley]

Trouble both those suits have the two zips that meet below the chin, these zips can move apart and are difficult to close properly as you can't see them - this was my downfall. Has anyone tried that mega expensive one? It would be good to here a review.
Began beekeeping 20 years ago with a standard Sherriff suit which, though expensive then, was relatively less so, if you see what I mean. It has lasted brilliantly wel and still in good condition though I had a new mesh fitting by Sherriff last summer when my darned holes began coming apart.

Now I also have a lightweight one from BBWear (fairly expensive but not as per Sherriff: see [URL="http://www.bbwear.co.uk/clothing/fullsuits/rr101.html"]). This is my favourite, by far. An excellent suit in dense but light, soft fabric. Possibly it's not the best choice if you have super-feisty bees trying to sting through clothing ... can't vouch for that either way.

Both have Velcro beneath the zip join in the front of the veil so, if you remember to press the zip ends down, this makes sure no bees can wander in, even if a zip is not quite closed. Both companies offer veil replacement if/when this is necessary.

For committed beekeepers, I think it's a false economy to buy a cheap suit. Those I have tried or witnessed in use generally have clumsy, ill-fitting zips, heavy material and few pockets. They are very hot in sunny weather (even in the Highlands). Having said that, we plan to buy from Simonthebeekeeper for visitor suits for the Amm apiary. Remarkable value and reasonably well made.

[Kate Atchley]

This is where the bee house is good.
Would love to have a bee house here in Ardnamurchan. Maybe I could come over to see your some time Bridget?
Kate

[busybeephilip]

Yes, 60 mites in 300 bees is a bit high and thats what I'm afraid of, as soon as the brood nest shrinks those mites will be competing for the brood resulting in a load of deformed wings in the autumn and colony collapse, and this bad weather means that fewer mites will be lost in the field

[Jon]

Yes, 60 mites in 300 bees is a bit high and thats what I'm afraid of, as soon as the brood nest shrinks those mites will be competing for the brood resulting in a load of deformed wings in the autumn and colony collapse, and this bad weather means that fewer mites will be lost in the field

Sure is! Depending who you ask the recommended treatment threshold is either 3+ or 6+.
Randy Oliver has a load of stuff about mite counting on his site.
Lots of mine had a mite count in the 20s for the 300 bee sample.
All looks ok at the moment but a lot of those would collapse in the autumn if treatment did not take place in August.

[derekm]

I changed a colony from a Paynes hive to a Bee Hive Supplies hive recently. The BHS hive has a kind of porch entrance rather than a straight walk-into entrance as in a Paynes, and this is a picture of how I found them this morning. I don't know whether it means they just like sitting around outside under the shelter of the porch; or whether they feel they ought to be there to better guard the hive as the actual entrance is now a bit hidden; or whether the entrance became too congested for them all to go inside (and I should be worried). They did not do this in the Paynes.
Kitta
2349

I 've seen this numerous times on this hive. I'm inclined to think it may be that bees loiter in warmer entrances. In our PIR hives the entrance tunnels are always well occupied by bees. In fact it can take some work to get them all out. Why ? Defence or even heat retention I.e. The hives insulating walls are the other sides of the cluster? but this behaviour seems limited to only very well insulated hives with certain entrances.

[Mellifera Crofter]

... I'm inclined to think it may be that bees loiter in warmer entrances. ...

Thanks Derek - I'll stop worrying then. They just like hanging out on the 'stoep'. I wish my own house on my wild hill had a stoep like that.
Kitta

[The Drone Ranger]

Having said that, we plan to buy from Simonthebeekeeper for visitor suits for the Amm apiary. Remarkable value and reasonably well made.
I have one of his lightweight suits bought for helping out
My beat up old BB wear jacket stays at home (bio security)
The fencing veil needs a hat underneath or you will get stung on the head
£35 but not recommended
Its predecessor was from Solway bees and the hood zip jammed on day one and Mrs DR had to repair it
They had stitched a straight zip in a circle by putting a few kinks in it Again about £30
Not so many stings got through that one though

[Kate Atchley]

Grafted in my usual way on Sunday and switched boxes round Monday (per Pasaga Ramic). Took a quick look at the cell-raising frame and this curtain of bees looked good: see pic ...

2350

Today found one solitary cell being drawn from 16, and that one not yet quite capped, so slow. Bees well fed with syrup.

The weather has continued to be cold and wet and the bees seem to have gone on queen-raising strike. Should I give up or try again if the conditions improve? Very disheartening.

[The Drone Ranger]

Are you using the Cloake board method or a queenless cell raiser Kate
I googled Pasaga Ramic and came up with a list of Indian Restaurants

[Kate Atchley]

Are you using the Cloake board method or a queenless cell raiser Kate
I googled Pasaga Ramic and came up with a list of Indian Restaurants

Prakel wrote about this last year and uses it successfully. Try Googling <Elgon/Pasaga Ramic method>. It's here in the Forum in "Queen raising 2014" where Prakel gave references on 04.07.2014:

"There are blog entries describing the method by Erik Osterlund here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=167) and more recent follow ups here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=498) and here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=502)."

[prakel]

The weather has continued to be cold and wet and the bees seem to have gone on queen-raising strike. Should I give up or try again if the conditions improve? Very disheartening.

Assuming a need for more queens/wish to further tweak your system I reckon it's worth the effort to continue but the final results will as always rest totally with the bees.The one thing we can't do is force them to produce good queens -although there appears to be a growing group who believe that bees always make good queens and they can even spout reference to spurious research that proves the fact; unfortunately, no matter how many times they're asked for a link it's never forthcoming (beyond .... "so and so said it exists"). But that's an entirely different hobby horse which I plan to corral during the winter months.

...So, if they only want to rear one that might actually be a better investment of your resources than a dozen which haven't received quite the same attention. If drones are still looking good and there's a chance of improved weather then the odds might be with you but the weather's always the biggest gamble we take. I think the main cost of queen rearing is at the mating nuc end of the programme -a failed cell builder costs little compared to a dozen failed nucs.

[Jon]

The weather looks better for queen mating from next week.

[prakel]

The weather looks better for queen mating from next week.

Which also bodes well for our site on an August flowering benweed reserve!

[Jon]

I don't think many will have flown in the past 10-12 days. 19 July was the last decent mating day here.

[Kate Atchley]

Assuming a need for more queens/wish to further tweak your system I reckon it's worth the effort to continue ... If drones are still looking good and there's a chance of improved weather then the odds might be with you but the weather's always the biggest gamble we take. I think the main cost of queen rearing is at the mating nuc end of the programme -a failed cell builder costs little compared to a dozen failed nucs.

Thanks Prakel. Plenty of handsome drones around and queens in demand so will watch for a drier, warmer spell before bothering the bees again ... I'll let the weather inform whether I try again.

[Jon]

I did 50 grafts on Wednesday into 3 colonies, 20, 20 and 10.
One started 10, another only 5 and the final one had acquired a virgin between Wednesday and today so started no cells.
Conditions are certainly not ideal and it is raining again today.
If a colony starts no cells at all I always assume it has acquired a virgin from somewhere and I go looking for it.
It had no virgin on Wednesday as it had sealed queen cells on a bar which I removed before inserting the new graft.
It will have flown in from one of the apideas on the site.
This happens quite often if you have queenless colonies and apideas on the same site.

[The Drone Ranger]

Prakel wrote about this last year and uses it successfully. Try Googling <Elgon/Pasaga Ramic method>. It's here in the Forum in "Queen raising 2014" where Prakel gave references on 04.07.2014:

"There are blog entries describing the method by Erik Osterlund here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=167) and more recent follow ups here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=498) and here (http://www.elgon.es/diary/?p=502)."

Thanks Kate

There are so many complicated methods around
If you take the queen out of a colony
Graft from the same colony into a cell bar
Leaving the cell bar in the now queenless colony
Won't you get nearly 100% success rate ?
You can put her back later and move the cells above a QX
Just a thought :)

[Jon]

Yep. just remove a queen and insert a frame of grafts from the same colony or any other and you will get plenty started.
I set up a queenless colony in May and it has started about 20-30 cells per week for me since then. I add a couple of frames of brood per week to stop it developing laying workers.
I also start cells in queenright colonies but they do not start as many.
The biggest problem with queen rearing advice is over complicating matters. If you have a really strong queenless colony it will start loads of cells. You need to keep feeding brood to it to stop laying workers developing and also to keep it loaded with nurse bees.

[prakel]

If you take the queen out of a colony
Graft from the same colony into a cell bar
Leaving the cell bar in the now queenless colony
Won't you get nearly 100% success rate ?

Do you also remove the thousands of larvae which are all claiming attention from the nurses or just add the bar?

[The Drone Ranger]

Do you also remove the thousands of larvae which are all claiming attention from the nurses or just add the bar?

I don't know to be honest
I would be fairly confident that a decent hive could feed 20 queen cells and the rest of the brood
Do you think that's wrong ?

[prakel]

I'm sure they could feed them just like they do in any queen-right finisher but I'm wondering whether they'd start the twenty in the presence of the rest of the brood from which they can choose any larvae they like -ones which haven't been manhandled into cell cups. No matter how good the grafter is I can't believe that it's possible for a grafted larvae to be better than another which, being the same in all other respects, hasn't been grafted.

[The Drone Ranger]

You may be right prakel but I made a hive queenless knocked off their cells and started 18 out of 20
Course I bungled it and none hatched but that's just one of those things :)

I take your point its probably best to limit the options by removing their queen cells
I think they like vertical cells in preference to making one vertical from the face of the comb

There are more involved methods
Heres a pic of a video I bought some years back
On VHS tape (shows when that was)2351

Total palaver no wonder people didn't try to raise their own queens :)

When nurse bees have nothing to nurse they move on to other duties so I will stick my neck out here and say I think its best to have open brood for them to busy themselves with --- probably wrong

Err Jon's your man ask him Lol!

[The Drone Ranger]

I'm Off Topic again
Heres todays news
2352
Thats wasps drilling their way into my Paynes poly nuc to get the syrup
They have some way to go yet
No I didn't spill the syrup
For some reason two of the nucs seem to be bit porous in the feed slot department
Keeping the blighters busy and they are so easy to squash
Mrs DR helpfully pointed out I should have painted them :)

[prakel]

DR:

My interest was raised by your comment that this method would be easier than starting the cells in a broodless box and then moving them above an excluder for finishing (Pasaga Ramic). There are other aspects of the suggested method (such as the absolute need to keep a check on all of the combs for rogue cells) which makes me think that it's probably more involved than the sales pitch suggests!


Err Jon's your man ask him Lol!

Well, all are welcome to chime in when it comes to increasing my understanding of what it is I'm trying to do :).

[Jon]

Prakel. If you take a queen out of a strong colony and put in a frame with grafts 10 minutes later they usually start a lot of them.
I think the orientation of the cup is the key factor, ie they look like cups from which queen cells will be drawn.
They have hundreds of suitable age larvae of their own and they will start a few from these but they seem to prefer the cups on the graft frame.

[Kate Atchley]

Yep. just remove a queen and insert a frame of grafts from the same colony or any other and you will get plenty started..

Jon, I see that you and Drone Ranger regard my method as over-complicated — though it's a minor variant on using a Cloake board — but perhaps I was not clear. I've used exactly the same method for each batch of cells this Summer, with success of around 66% fed/drawn queen cells overall. This latest batch led to only one cell.

I don't know of an explanation other than weather and colony strength: the early days of these cells' development (or failure) brought more wet days of 11C or 12C as through most of May and June. Though breeding colonies are fed, their brood boxes remain light and empty of retained stores. Amongst the Amm bees we're managing, there are no "strong" or "decent" colonies this year, as I understand the term ... only colonies making a remarkably good job of coping with extraordinarily difficult conditions.

Perhaps in such conditions breeder colonies need to be run with constant feeders and no supers, and extra pollen and/or substitute (though my bees seem to dislike pollen substitutes). I had some spare pollen but it's been used already. Maybe that approach would lead to better success with the queen raising.

It's certainly been sunnier and milder in the east of Scotland ... perhaps also in Ireland?

[Jon]

Kate, I was not thinking about your methods at all when I mentioned over complicated stuff. I was thinking about some of the stuff I have read over the years in the Bibba magazine. Most of the Irish bee breeders I know are big fans of the Cloake board. I was only responding to DR's post about removing a queen from a colony. There are lots of ways to get queen cells started.
I always share what works for me with others on the forum.

[nemphlar]

DR wasps and polynucs, a tub of petroleum jelly is a good short term fix for stopping the wasps digging holes in soft poly

[The Drone Ranger]

Jon, I see that you and Drone Ranger regard my method as over-complicated

Steady the Buffs :)
Kate I apologise if you think I am casting dispersions on your no doubt well researched method
I honestly have no Idea what the ragu punic method involves (clearly)

What I will say in my defense is that the first two sets of queens I raised this year were using a cupkit in a Ben Harden queenright system
They both worked fine apart from some disappearances and mating failures at the mininuc stage which reduced the numbers by about 50%

As the season moved forward and Oil Seed Rape disappeared they lost interest in raising queencells in a queen right colony

So now I dequeened two colonies one Smith double broodbox and one paynes nuc double broodbox
I also set up another double broodbox Smith hive queenright Ben Harden style using a third box on top

Now before dequeening the Poly Nuc the queen was put in a cupkit and it took a day for her to lay (it was overnight the first two times)
Those eggs became larva and went on cell bar in that now queenless double poly nuc got 18 starts from 20

Also using cupkit larva the queenless Smith hive had 18 starts from 20
Those all made sealed queencells (which I fiddled with too much and lost the lot)
So then I grafted into that hive and it was 7 starts from 10 (unusually high for me)
That reduced to 5 after a few days

The queen right Ben Harden Smith triple hive not so good
I put 10 cupkit larva in no starts
I grafted into it next no starts
Tried one more time no starts
So at that point in the season using that hive I was wasting my time

It's probably horses for courses. So early season the queenright method was best and mid season the queenless method was best
It could be weather related or to do with passing the longest day and how the bees feel about that
My post is just part question part suggestion
Added refinements and complications are sometimes just that, and don't always get any better results
Hope the next lot are all 100 success
DR

[mbc]

Today I've put out all but 4 of 42 cells from my last grafft of the season, cloak board's put away and cell builders being cleared of supers ready for thymol, one of them was showing a bit of varroa damage. 4 cells that didn't get placed are in the airing cupboard, I must invest in a proper incubator. That's 12 rounds of grafts, two frames of twenty odd cells each time, failures are being got by the wasps now so a good time to start winding it all up.

[The Drone Ranger]

DR wasps and polynucs, a tub of petroleum jelly is a good short term fix for stopping the wasps digging holes in soft poly

Cheers Nemphlar for that solution
Most welcome answer to an annoying problem

Between flappy top crown boards
Dodgy bee squashing fat sides
No flippin frame rails
Bee munching and now wasp munching

I'm going right off poly hives

[The Drone Ranger]

4 cells that didn't get placed are in the airing cupboard, I must invest in a proper incubator.

Excellent plan to convince Mrs mbc that an incubator should be on the Xmas list

[The Drone Ranger]

DR:

There are other aspects of the suggested method (such as the absolute need to keep a check on all of the combs for rogue cells) which makes me think that it's probably more involved than the sales pitch suggests!
.

Guilty M'Lud

[prakel]

Prakel. If you take a queen out of a strong colony and put in a frame with grafts 10 minutes later they usually start a lot of them.
I think the orientation of the cup is the key factor, ie they look like cups from which queen cells will be drawn.
They have hundreds of suitable age larvae of their own and they will start a few from these but they seem to prefer the cups on the graft frame.

In which case I'm genuinely surprised that more people aren't raising their quality queens with this method.

[Kate Atchley]

Steady the Buffs :)
As the season moved forward and Oil Seed Rape disappeared they lost interest in raising queencells in a queen right colony

So now I dequeened two colonies one Smith double broodbox and one paynes nuc double brood box ...

The queen right Ben Harden Smith triple hive not so good ... I put 10 cupkit larva in no starts ... I grafted into it next no starts ... Tried one more time no starts
So at that point in the season using that hive I was wasting my time

... So early season the queenright method was best and mid season the queenless method was best
... Hope the next lot are all 100 success
DR

DR that's hugely helpful. Many thanks for sharing your results and showing the changing pattern of cell building in different conditions, through the season. (And a relief to know others too sometimes have no or poor starts!) Reading this, I'm pretty sure that my bees in the queenless cell starter day 1 began to start lots of cells (hence curtain of wax-builders hanging from them) but once the frame was above the Qx with the queen below, they changed behaviour to being stingy and drawing out only one cell. It ties in with your experience.

Rain is forecast for days and days but I'll feed up a colony with a view to creating queenless conditions and will try again when there's a break. So watch this space!

[prakel]

I'll feed up a colony with a view to creating queenless conditions and will try again when there's a break. So watch this space!

Your mini-plus hives probably aren't mature enough yet but just a thought -I've been using very strong double box mp's for cell raising with great success through the summer. True minimization of resources. Don't know how many good cells one of those units could handle as I've not needed to try for more than a dozen (which they handle very well) in one box at a time. Just another 'possible' to either consider or forget :).

[Kate Atchley]

Interesting you add this Prakel. Plan to overwinter a few queens in double Mp boxes but, as you suggest, they're not strong enough to try this yet. Had also been wondering about fitting a Cupkit box into an mp frame and trying that and the mp cell raising next year, taking the queen and some of youngest brood out with the CK box.

I love grafting (though presumably lose some larvae through clumsiness) but the CK system can be useful and avoids larval damage.

Our colonies here are not large (Amm generally create small colonies and there's no OSR or equivalent here) so trying for 12 cells at a time would be fine. Do you double up the cells vertically in one frame or spread over two frames to go into the mps alongside one another?

[Jon]

In which case I'm genuinely surprised that more people aren't raising their quality queens with this method.

The key thing is colony strength. It has to be boiling over with bees.
Once you get cells started you have the option to move them on to a queenright colony for finishing or leave them where they are if the colony is strong enough to deal with them.

[prakel]

Once you get cells started you have the option to move them on to a queenright colony for finishing or leave them where they are if the colony is strong enough to deal with them.

Although I'm still not really convinced that this is a truly efficient way to start cells I will give it a go at some point.

But whatever route you take, you've got to shake through all of the combs in search of cells whether there are any or not. So I still fail to understand how this is acually easier than a broodless starter or one with only sealed brood as it's been suggested to be.

[prakel]

Do you double up the cells vertically in one frame or spread over two frames to go into the mps alongside one another?

I've been using two bars (not even frames) with a comb between them to avoid any comb building games which they might try in a double space.

[Jon]

Although I'm still not really convinced that this is a truly efficient way to start cells I will give it a go.

But at some point, whatever route you take, you've got to shake through all of the combs in search of cells

You have to do that with a queenright system as well as the combs are constantly being circulated from the bottom box to the box above the excluder.
It is a PITA and if you miss a cell and a virgin emerges you lose a frame of cells. A couple of years ago at the association apiary I missed a cell on a comb and the cell starter swarmed with the virgin! I had to climb up a thorn tree to get it back.

[The Drone Ranger]

Although I'm still not really convinced that this is a truly efficient way to start cells I will give it a go at some point.

But whatever route you take, you've got to shake through all of the combs in search of cells whether there are any or not. So I still fail to understand how this is acually easier than a broodless starter or one with only sealed brood as it's been suggested to be.

Hi prakel
My VHS tape recorder gave up the ghost so I can't watch the old tape again
That's going to bug me now and I'm afraid it's all your fault LOL!

[The Drone Ranger]

Interesting you add this Prakel. Plan to overwinter a few queens in double Mp boxes but, as you suggest, they're not strong enough to try this yet. Had also been wondering about fitting a Cupkit box into an mp frame and trying that and the mp cell raising next year, taking the queen and some of youngest brood out with the CK box.

My tip is fit the cupkit to the frame and just surround it with foundation
If conditions are right they will draw that wax out
Well that works for me Kate

Cutting drawn frames and putting it in one is a pain
It's alien comb to them anyway and they start filling it with nectar
That's extra mess

[Kate Atchley]

I've been using two bars (not even frames) with a comb between them to avoid any comb building games which they might try in a double space.

Gotcha! Is it raining everywhere? Lots of us online!

[prakel]

You have to do that with a queenright system as well as the combs are constantly being circulated from the bottom box to the box above the excluder.
It is a PITA and if you miss a cell

That's my point, it entails work even though it's being presented as an alternative to the


many complicated methods around

Personally I can't see how it's less complicated than a broodless starter.

[prakel]

Hi prakel
My VHS tape recorder gave up the ghost so I can't watch the old tape again
That's going to bug me now and I'm afraid it's all your fault LOL!

So many things have been! There are people with the ability to transfer commercial vhs onto disk. But I'm doubtful about the legalities of the beast.

[prakel]

Is it raining everywhere? Lots of us online!

Brilliant sunshine and nectar going into the boxes at last. If only the rain had come sooner.

[Jon]

Personally I can't see how it's less complicated than a broodless starter.

I don't think there is any method which does not involve a fair bit of work and some care about when cells are likely to emerge.
With my queenless starter which I feed brood to every week I have run it for three months and put through 2 batches of cells per week on average since mid May.
You have to take frames out and put frames in but that's no big deal. I often put in the frame I have just grafted from. The open brood pheromone helps prevent the development of laying workers.
This also avoids having to open the graft donor colony twice as you do not have to open a second time to replace the frame when you have finished grafting.

The most labour intensive part of the work is checking the apideas and all this entails and also marking, clipping and caging queens for posting plus all the e-mail communication with the people they are posted to.
Grafting and getting cells started is a critical part of the work but fortunately does not have to take up a massive percentage of the time involved to get the finished product.

With a broodless starter do you start a fresh one every couple of weeks or what way do you work it?

[The Drone Ranger]

Brilliant sunshine and nectar going into the boxes at last. If only the rain had come sooner.
I was happy this morning to see sun and did a few inspections
My attempt to get the laying workers in a keiler to adopt a larva have failed
The geniuses are now raising a queen cell on drone larva instead
Weather has all changed now --- heavy rain
Fiddlestix

I am no expert as you know, but sometimes the straightforward approach is enough
Take grafting, most people just find a suitable frame
Some more dedicated, recommend frame trapping the queen to ensure the whole frame is at the right stage
In a big commercial operation they do all this stuff but on a small scale its not essential
Just saying :)

Ps.
I remembered an article on how to make a ringing table for microscope slides
The main component was a head from a Video Recorder
All is not lost after all :)

[prakel]

With a broodless starter do you start a fresh one every couple of weeks or what way do you work it?

I personally rotate around different hives so they have one 'go' and then they can get back to normal life. There's no need with this method to have a dedicated unit. It suits me to use different colonies which are often (but not always) in totally different locations. At present this is proving an ideal way for me to manage things.

The point which I feel is getting lost here is that I personally have no major hang-ups about how to do things -I'm more than happy to change anything if it improves results or adds some other benefit so when someone suggests a method which I've never contemplated and he's backed up by a commercial queen breeder then of course questions will spring to mind. I trialled the method that I'm currently using for the first time last year and have used it almost exclusively this year. I say 'almost' because I've also played around with another method too but to a much lesser extent. So there's no question about my flexibility.

[Jon]

I agree prakel. If it works, it works, and the variations on the methodology are not the most important thing.
Since I scaled up a bit I am looking for ways to save time and cut out any bits of the routine which are not mission critical.
If you are working on your own there is a limit to how much you can produce and it focuses the mind re. which method is more time consuming than any other.
I could do grafts in a day to produce cells for many more apideas than I can manage on my own.
The bottlenecks lie elsewhere.

[HJBee]

Thought I would share a picture from our Apiary visit today, which in true Ian Craig style was interesting and spontaneous. Even in the changeable weather the bees were in quite good form. Lots to see and learn.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/02/4958a4ca32d17b7f92c07744e9db66f2.jpg

[Kate Atchley]

Never seen bees trying to kill a swinging cat before. Splendid shot!

[gavin]

I think I've been in that apiary - but it was winter (winter talk time) and Ian didn't quite have the magic then to command the bees to assemble in the tree above.

[HJBee]

They all congregated there as the various entrances in Ian's double decker stacking system were blocked by us Beeks. One swift smack with a brolly and they dispersed and 5 mins after hardly any left hanging in the air!

[fatshark]

First day of Scottish beekeeping ... wheelbarrowed a couple of dozen unused supers to the storage barn in the rain.

Is this typical?

[gavin]

Absolutely. A barn far away will do, you may need them in 2017.

With both you *and* H-J on this thread it is best not to mention wheelbarrows. I have a recollection now of a certain cartoon character you were discussing and it isn't a pretty picture.

[gavin]

.... were blocked by U.S. Beeks.

That man is quite some draw.

[Jon]

I think we all remember Buster Gonad

[gavin]

I think we all remember Buster Gonad

I'm just away to tinker with the settings to stop anyone posting images for a while ........

[Jon]

scarred for life...

[HJBee]

[emoji23]

[prakel]

Looks like a lot of spam coming this way, based on the legion of 'people' currently registering accounts.....

[gavin]

Thanks R. Grrrrr .... about an hour of tidying up ahead of me. About one hundred new accounts to delete, one by one. I have appropriate barriers up now though and will strengthen some others before I'm done. Thanks for the warning.

[Feckless Drone]

First day of Scottish beekeeping ... wheelbarrowed a couple of dozen unused supers to the storage barn in the rain.

Is this typical?

The new Ivor Cutler has arrived!

Pleased to see that Qs have picked up this last week in Tayside. Forgotten what it was like to see a full frame of brood or feel some weight in a super. Lime and willowherb now yielding well in Dundee. A check showed all but one colony with enough stores. The exception, that was on the brink of starvation, was a colony moved within an apiary and having lost most of the flying bees was struggling. My bad - I should have given more stores when I moved them.

[Jon]

Fatshark has a new life to look forward to.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GX1DVnNWtGY

[busybeephilip]

We got a good July http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-33757981

Thats why I've no honey!

[gwizzie]

Weather here this morning was terrible but about 11am the clouds parted and the sun has been out ever since. The swarm hive in my back garden has been working like a trojan today and they're still at it, these bees seem different from my other ones as they seem harder workers ? if this keep up they will be going to the heather with my other hive!

just checked the temp in back garden and its 22deg now

[HJBee]

Today I've been snooping on my Ayrshire Neighbours
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/07/e8a97ce21a59a6d80144a23f5beb7837.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/07/8ad4cafdced34405c949f0a1e7eeeb9b.jpg
Love their Display, responsible for me being a beekeeper!http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/07/f9e71905d920032f522bce17801698d8.jpg

[The Drone Ranger]

HJBee is there a mesh on the front of that shed thing ?
I doubt if the nylon rope would keep many bees in :)

[HJBee]

[emoji23] and I'm stood in front of the live honey bees, keep out sign.

Yes there is fine Mesh, they bring them in 2-3 days before the show opens and the bees learn to fly high, over all the show goers heads before opening. They had plenty of Lime trees to forage on. This set up is great as the suit & boot anyone who is interested and get them in and handling the frames. [emoji219]

[The Drone Ranger]

I must get some of that mesh on my visor
Don't be surprised to find a bit snipped out
This morning was spent getting the grey fergie tractor out of a mud hole where it dug itself in
What a carry on :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZAs_HlWyNk&feature=youtu.be


I never saw a need for a butterfly net but I've just spent ages chasing a Red Admiral round the house before I finally got him out
I'm off to Amazon to get a net
2382

[The Drone Ranger]

Looks like a lot of spam coming this way.

Yum!

[Black Comb]

I must get some of that mesh on my visor
Don't be surprised to find a bit snipped out
This morning was spent getting the grey fergie tractor out of a mud hole where it dug itself in
What a carry on :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZAs_HlWyNk&feature=youtu.be


I never saw a need for a butterfly net but I've just spent ages chasing a Red Admiral round the house before I finally got him out
I'm off to Amazon to get a net
2382

Grey Fergie. That takes me back a while. Is it TVO?

[The Drone Ranger]

Black Comb its a diesel so easier to operate
1952 they new how to build them in those days

[prakel]

Yum!

No chance, the Boss intercepted it!

[gavin]

There's nothing like a video of some mud to get you set up for the day.

Snuck a couple of hives up to Glen Isla last night. Always fun moving bees in the dark. The ling heather is later than I've ever known - there wasn't a single flower out yet in the areas illuminated by my head torch. Pink buds are showing but it could be a week before it is flowering well. Large areas of dead heather stems to the south but immediately around the apiary site it looks fine.

Locally the lime is still in flower here and there (ditto on the lateness). Will try to recover the harvest today.

[The Drone Ranger]

No chance, the Boss intercepted it!

Drat !!
He doesn't need it with all that honey coming in
Is bread and dripping with promises of jam tomorrow here

[busybeephilip]

Black Comb its a diesel so easier to operate
1952 they new how to build them in those days

Problem with Fergies is they are very low horse power eg 20 or 35, but good in their day ! That looks like it could be a nice tractor restoration project, you can still get all the parts

[The Drone Ranger]

That's true but I only use the tractor for topping mowing the grass and a bit of ploughing and rotavating for potato planting with a small ridger
The biggest bugbear is the PTO doesn't have a separate clutch

[busybeephilip]

DR - over run clutch adapter

[busybeephilip]

Just looking at some bees yesterday, hive weights still falling slowly

[Jon]

You taken any supers off yet Phil?
The only ones I have removed so far are from the new apiary I set up in Tyrone.
I should have about 200lbs from 6 colonies which is ok as those were started from 6 frame nucs in April.
the Belfast apiaries have produced very little.
I'll have a few supers from 4 colonies I have at the bottom of the garden.
The suburban forage is more reliable.
The mating apiaries will not produce a huge amount as the colonies are set up to make drones.
Spent this morning removing queens from Apideas. Hateful work in the rain and bad light.

[busybeephilip]

Hey Jon,

Was planning to do just that but other things have got in the way, hard to estimate yield just at present but its well down on last years anyway need to make sure I get a big supply of syrup ready to feed after taking supers off. Most of the hives are still very strong as my swarm control without increase worked really well this year so plenty of bees eating the crop as I type! There was clear differences between my old bees and the new ones in swarming behaviour which I'll get your opinion on this evening :)

Hard to predict best forage, my out apiary is surrounded by grazing land, plenty of clover (now done) and still a bit of blackberry left and loads ragwort courtesy of ards council saving money by not cutting the verges. I would have imagined that you and alan R would have got a good crop at the NT site, its odd how a few miles can make a difference maybe its height above sea level ?

Are you api-gaurding yet ? I made a OA evaporator out of an aluminium block, standard type of design but I'm going to make a sublimox type design so that you dont have to switch on and off and wait for the thing to cool down, all the pro's in EU use them now but very expensive to buy, only a few £ to make one.

Queen rearing was a bit of a failure, too many drone layers being produced, was talking to someone else over the weekend from Dromore who is into this and he found the same thing, most likely weather related, I'm wondering if I should try one last batch of grafting in the hope of a good september (indian summer huh..), but at the moment everything is winding down and getting plagued by wasps robbing

[The Drone Ranger]

DR - over run clutch adapter

Hi Phill
Yes I have one on the topping mower and an adjustable friction slipper plate PTO shaft for the rotavator
The ability to lift depends on the PTO being turning which is a pain either disconnecting the power shaft first or driving into a shed with a still rotating mower or rotavator
If you manage to stall with a thing like the rotavator on the back it can be a real a real pain getting the shaft off the PTO (so you can lift without the rotavator turning)
Bit impractical on some levels but I have had it 10 years so learned just to put up with it
Later tractors you can stop the PTO and still lift the implement that must be great (and safer)
What am I saying ?? I'll never sell it now!! Shot myself in the foot :)

[gavin]

Just keeking earlier at the rainfall for Scotland in July. Bear in mind this is % deviation from normal. The west is wetter anyway.

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/pub/data/weather/uk/climate/anomacts/2015/7/2015_7_Rainfall_Anomaly_1981-2010.gif
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/pub/data/weather/uk/climate/anomacts/2015/7/2015_7_Rainfall_Actual.gif

[gavin]

The Moving Hives posts are now in a thread of their own:

http://www.sbai.org.uk/sbai_forum/showthread.php?2037-Moving-hives

[fatshark]

Just keeking earlier at the rainfall for Scotland in July. Bear in mind this is % deviation from normal. The west is wetter anyway.

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/pub/data/weather/uk/climate/anomacts/2015/7/2015_7_Rainfall_Anomaly_1981-2010.gif


Ah Ha ... that would explain why when moving bees from one of those white bits in the middle to one of those dark blue bits in the top right I was feeding fondant within 10 days ...

... but in fairness, they're piling something or other in now to the strong hives.

[gavin]

Ah Ha ... that would explain why when moving bees from one of those white bits in the middle to one of those dark blue bits in the top right I was feeding fondant within 10 days ...

... but in fairness, they're piling something or other in now to the strong hives.

Courtesy of DR's delightful taxonomy it could be from White Stuff, Pink Stuff or Blue Stuff. Maybe, at a pinch, Green Stuff or even Yellow Stuff.

[Jon]

Yes it was useful to have DR kick that outdated Kirk's guide to pollen loads into touch with a more comprehensive review.

[The Drone Ranger]

Your welcome I'm sure :)

I have run out of available min nuc queens due to replacing drone layers and disappearing queens
There are a few keilers with virgins in the pipeline
I was queen marking at a friends apiary yesterday who has 5 hives and 2 were drone layers
One queen was replaced by a laying one which I had spare
The other was swarm where the queen was a drone layer messing up all the combs
That one was just shook out in front of another hive close by
It wasn't big to start with and had dwindled too much

Funny season this year for queen mating and disappearing virgins

[HJBee]

Been a year for disappearing newly mated & laying queens too from what I hear. I lost 1 Virgin queen, but can't complain as doubled the stock. Poor honey harvest though, just enough to pay the rent and a few boxes of cut comb to offset recent bee related purchases.

[The Drone Ranger]

As long as you can break even hjbee you will be doing better than most 🍯

Sent from my LIFETAB_S1034X using Tapatalk

[lindsay s]

Three out of four new queens have started laying this week I’ll give the other a week to ten days before I consider uniting. The supers will be coming off next weekend and the honey crop from my main apiary will be very poor this year but the two hives at my other site are still piling it in.
The Kirkwall Flower Arrangement Club had a display in the St Magnus Cathedral this week. Here’s a photo of The Honey-Bee Swarm. It was created by my beekeeping friend Sue so I thought I would share all her lovely work with you.:)
2384

[The Drone Ranger]

How brilliant is that Well done to Sue !!

[EK.Bee]

Deep joy, the daughters of Satan are no more!
The second attempt at introducing a placid Queen has succeeded!
A seemingly small thing, but for me, a major triumph
The whole Apiary was back to a pleasure to work in
Doing the Munchkin dance :D Ding Dong!

[Kate Atchley]

What a relief! At last the bees have been taking in loads of pollen and nectar and brood frames have arches of honey and colourful pollens. They've been making the best of some better weather and the late flow. Have decided to graft another couple of batches of larvae for late queens. Dusted off the Cloake board for these.

[EK.Bee]

Anyone else suffered from Absconding MAQS?
left half a box of MAQS strips in the chest freezer to safely over winter
Went to defrost them ---------- Gone
Nobody touched them
I note however a preponderance of black currents in the chest freezer
As it is unlikely that blackcurrents will induce a heavy mite drop or banish slugs I am at a loss :(
My Nosemic bee collection is similarly missing. Grounds for divorce due to unreasonable behaviour?
I fear for my unwashed sticky feeder tower in the downstairs shower!

[gavin]

Weird stuff that MAQS. I wouldn't trust it.

I stick to Apiguard, ApilifeVar and Apivar and packs of oxalic acid crystals. They're much better behaved. OK, they jump around from box to box and even shed to car to store but I can usually track them down eventually. Much better behaved miticides.

[mbc]

I had a whole kochstar wax melter run away from the kitchen while my back was turned, and bee samples always seem to evaporate from the freezer.

[Feckless Drone]

I took some advice from C4U given at an association meeting awhile back and been watching how Gavin sets up for the heather. So, I united colonies for typical summer blossom and got a lovely honey due to mainly lime flow in late July. I tested out a site for heather and thought it might be a bit exposed - but the heather and weather came good later on - end result a good yield (by my standards), lots of comb to cut and sections. but, just when you think you are making progress with this craft something happens. The downs - removing a super from a serious box of bees, which was stuck to 4 brood combs. The whole lot comes out and brood combs knocked off as I move to the side. Mayhem and wheres the Q? Three days later - eggs (but could have been laid just before my act of vandalism), but no Q-cell started so maybe hope. Weekend job to find her or not.

[gavin]

That section is so light it seems to be floating to the ceiling :).

Seriously though, getting sections filled in 2015 is no mean feat. Could well be the only sections filled in Tayside in years.

[Calluna4u]

I took some advice from C4U given at an association meeting awhile back and been watching how Gavin sets up for the heather. So, I united colonies for typical summer blossom and got a lovely honey due to mainly lime flow in late July. I tested out a site for heather and thought it might be a bit exposed - but the heather and weather came good later on - end result a good yield (by my standards), lots of comb to cut and sections. but, just when you think you are making progress with this craft something happens. The downs - removing a super from a serious box of bees, which was stuck to 4 brood combs. The whole lot comes out and brood combs knocked off as I move to the side. Mayhem and wheres the Q? Three days later - eggs (but could have been laid just before my act of vandalism), but no Q-cell started so maybe hope. Weekend job to find her or not.

In best Father Jack tradition, I would make a small wager the Drone was far from 'Feck'less after that! Things do happen to all of us that are liable to 'bring forth intemperate language'.

[gavin]

Things do happen to all of us that are liable to 'bring forth intemperate language'.

Absolutely! Like season 2015 ....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N20wHvMPTGs

[mbc]

Lol.

[fatshark]

No beekeeping whatsoever today but I saw a hell of a lot of bees ... I had a half day of late season trout fishing on the River Eden in Fife. The banks are thick with balsam in places, though it's clearly coming to an end. Those flowers remaining were being worked hard by thousands of bees. Some were nearly completely white they were so covered with pollen. A lovely sight.

[Greengage]

Spent a bit of time searching for this little chap but no luck so far....
http://www.biodiversityireland.ie/can-you-find-the-first-irish-ivy-bee/

[fatshark]

It's got a way to go yet ... http://www.bwars.com/index.php?q=content/colletes-hederae-2015 ... but it got that far in 14 years so shouldn't be too long.

[Greengage]

Since this is scottish forum this might interest you http://www.bwars.com/index.php?q=content/wild-bees-scotland-guide-published

[Calluna4u]

You see something new every year................
Never ever in my time. or my fathers, have we seen a flow in October. We are not talking ivy, much loved by some beekeepers in the south. It is balsam. Was out feeding hives today that had come home from the heather and were due to get their full winter feed, as usual at this time we have several frames of foundation inserted in the nest to be drawn on the feed. These bees had been home only three days.

To my surprise the middle frames of foundation were drawn or in the process of being drawn. 'Ghost bees' everywhere. Pulled out some centre bars to see what was going on and the nectar fell out like water. Some of the foundation was nearly fully drawn, already had the start of a pollen arc and had eggs in the centre. a truly exceptional week for early October, and one we might not see again for a long long time.

To the botanists in our midst....What is the very rich red pollen that they are bringing in in quite large amounts at the same time as they are working balsam? No idea myself.

[gavin]

I'll admit to being a botanist and I also saw red pollen this afternoon. I'm not sure what it is but Scabious may be a possibility.

Maybe Jolanta will get her microscope out if you ask nicely!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5273/14266380747_9b5be69ec2_m.jpg

[Bridget]

Here at the southern end of the Spey the heather is still in bloom, patches of it still quite strong and the bees are still working hard bringing in pollen as well, mainly yellow not red. As they are still going strong and with the good weather our nucs had well outgrown their box and had to be transferred into a brood box, all be it with a large dummy board at one end. As we still have supers to come off the main hives we have not started with winter feed or varroa treatment yet.
This year is the first time we have had double brood boxes and supers. We reduced them to one brood box and one super 10 days ago but they look, too full to go down to just a brood box when we take the supers off next week. I know they will reduce in numbers soon but maybe not enough. I'm not sure if I shouldn't put the second brood box back or maybe go brood and a half. Any advice? People say brood and a half is a pain but with our winter here I would wonder if two brood boxes is too much.
These are the bad tempered hives I worried about in July. Despite advice to do away with the queens and set them up with the queens raised with Drumgerrys gentle bees we decided that they were doing too well to be killed off and decided to give them another winter and do away with them in the spring. Meantime I became allergic, my husband took over, they have been very kind to him and we have had about 100 lbs of honey so far with more to come off! Not sure what the moral of that story is but there must be one somewhere!


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