Wax processing - best solution !?

[greengumbo]

Hey all - I'm fed up of crappy wax processing.

Every year I generate 4 or 5 very large boxes of capping wax, broken frame wax, off cut wax with varying degrees of honey in it and debris. I dont have time to deal with it when its generated so I leave it in boxes till winter.

I'd love a simple but effective way of cleaning the wax. Obviously I would love an apimelter but cant really justify cost !

At the moment I put it bit by bit in a slow cooker in water in some nylon tights and leave it to melt. Then microwave it to pour into wax block moulds at a later date. Not great.

Any equipment you would recommend ? I would love to save the honey from it but its not likely I know - plus lots has set by the time I get round to dealing with it.

GG

[Mellifera Crofter]

So am I, GG, and I don't have a good answer. I keep the cappings wax separate from other wax in the hope of saving honey still in the wax for mead or cooking. I still have to find a good way of retrieving that honey.

As for the other wax, one of the easiest and cheapest options is to borrow a wax melter from the association (https://aberdeenbeekeepers.net/supplies/). I'm always pleased for an excuse to visit Sandy. They work like this one from Thornes (https://www.thorne.co.uk/honey-and-wax-processing/wax/wax-extraction?product_id=5670), but are round.

For further rendering and cleaning of large amounts of wax, I've bought a Kochstar from Abelo (they're not as fancy or expensive as the Thorne's ones). It's ok, but still not ideal. I've tried wrapping the wax in a large piece of muslin, but lifting the muslin out of the bucket of molten wax and trying to squeeze all the wax out of it, is difficult. I don't think I'll repeat that. Also difficult is lifting the bucket from the Kochstar and then pouring the wax into moulds - but it is quicker than a bain marie on a stove. You can also melt down larger pieces of wax. That was perhaps the main reason I bought the Kochstar - to melt down chunks of wax that's too large for a bain marie.

Kitta

[greengumbo]

So am I, GG, and I don't have a good answer. I keep the cappings wax separate from other wax in the hope of saving honey still in the wax for mead or cooking. I still have to find a good way of retrieving that honey.

As for the other wax, one of the easiest and cheapest options is to borrow a wax melter from the association (https://aberdeenbeekeepers.net/supplies/). I'm always pleased for an excuse to visit Sandy. They work like this one from Thornes (https://www.thorne.co.uk/honey-and-wax-processing/wax/wax-extraction?product_id=5670), but are round.

For further rendering and cleaning of large amounts of wax, I've bought a Kochstar from Abelo (they're not as fancy or expensive as the Thorne's ones). It's ok, but still not ideal. I've tried wrapping the wax in a large piece of muslin, but lifting the muslin out of the bucket of molten wax and trying to squeeze all the wax out of it, is difficult. I don't think I'll repeat that. Also difficult is lifting the bucket from the Kochstar and then pouring the wax into moulds - but it is quicker than a bain marie on a stove. You can also melt down larger pieces of wax. That was perhaps the main reason I bought the Kochstar - to melt down chunks of wax that's too large for a bain marie.

Kitta

Thanks Kitta ! I didn't think about the association but will do that. Seems like there are a few wax melters with the association. Do you know who has the good bigger one and I'll contact ?

[Mellifera Crofter]

I think they’re probably all about the same size, GG. I’ve only ever borrowed Sandy‘s - and I have it now - but I think he has two. I think Erling was expecting his back around now.

But I’ll hurry with Sandy’s. I promised to return it some time next week. I need space!
Kitta

[Adam]

I used to use a slow cooker but one day I forget it and the room was full of wax fumes and something dark and unpleasant inside the cracked slow-cooker bowl. I now have one with a timer and thermostat which is safer! I generally pour out the molten wax into plastic pots and let it cool, then take the worst of the junk off the bottom the now solidified wax and heat it again and then strain it through something. It's time-consuming and messy.

[fatshark]

I also use a slow cooker, though mine sounds a little safer than Adam's.
I melt it in the slow cooker with some rainwater, let it solidify in the pot, tip it out, scrape off the propolis and other junk that sinks to the bottom with a hive tool, then remelt it without water. This is then sufficiently clean to pour through a single sheet kitchen paper filter into ice cream containers. I use a silicone release spray in these first.
The resulting wax blocks are more than clean enough to trade for foundation (irrespective of the colour) or, if the wax is pale enough, make candles. I've also sold wax for woodturning and something to do with needlecraft or stitching.

I wouldn't use it for cosmetics (and refuse to sell it for this purpose) because any amount of 'slap' is too late for me ;)

Did you know you're supposed to be able to make wax paler coloured by treating with oxalic acid?

Allegedly. I've tried and was not successful :(

[Mellifera Crofter]

... I melt it in the slow cooker with some rainwater, let it solidify in the pot, tip it out, ...(

I suppose I can do that in my Kochstar - but I thought the wax might get stuck to the sides, and that I wouldn't be able to get it out from the Kochstar. I once melted a bucket of wax in my warming cabinet, and it was a struggle to get that solid wax out of the bucket! Isn't that a problem in the slow cooker?

[Jambo]

If you melt it with loads of water, you can then put a stick or similar in it when you start to let it cool. When it has solidified, pull out the stick, turn the vessel upside down, pour out the water and you can easily break the wax up because there's nothing underneath it.

[Mellifera Crofter]

Thanks Jambo, I'll try that!
Kitta

[fatshark]

The wax always shrinks away from the sidewall of the slow cooker as it cools. Sometimes I need to give the rim of the bowl a gently tap, but it always comes out pretty easily.

The stick is a good idea ...

[Jambo]

The stick is a good idea ...

Mediocre beekeeper, decent Engineer/bodger ;)

[fatshark]

'Decent bodger' would be good as occupation on a passport. I'd be pleased with that. Unfortunately mine would say 'Liability with power tools and mediocre beekeeper' ;)

[Neils]

i’m an exceptional beekeeper and a terrible liar.

my cunning plan next year is recycling a polyhive that the bees have chewed beyond use into a steam extractor. bits of wax, combs etc into an old pillow case and poke a wallpaper stripper through a hole in the side. hopefully clean wax out the entrance and clean frames at the end.

[Mellifera Crofter]

... my cunning plan next year is recycling a polyhive that the bees have chewed beyond use into a steam extractor. ...

Apart from the poor poly hive having been chewed, Neils, will it withstand all that heat?

And how is it that the hive got so badly chewed? What make is it?

Kitta

[Bridget]

This year I decided the green house would be a good place to process the wax, stop stinking out the house. Unfortunately the day warmed up, the automatic windows opened up and in came somewhere bees and many many wasps. So abandoned till a colder day.
I use a steaming set of pans meant for processing fruit I think. Wax sits in the sieve top in muslin and melts into the middle pan, with the water heating underneath. Works ok but would be a nightmare for large amounts. Then when solid all goes through again but there is still a bit of gunge on the bottom to be scraped off. Colours not bad though


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[Mellifera Crofter]

Do you mean something like this (https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00HA7CRNY/?coliid=I18659QF61XKQA&colid=26HW41T3KAO9J&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it), Bridget? That seems ideal for the final cleaning of small amounts of wax, and better than the really small bain marie I use for some final cleaning. As I was searching around Amazon I came across the same bain marie pot (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Haushalt-International-Simmer-1-2-Litres-Double-Wall/dp/B009S7O2CS/ref=sr_1_16?adgrpid=48742301890&gclid=Cj0KCQiAno_uBRC1ARIsAB496IVnG9goqxLsUYdTe-rQA5pV2pi346J7fp1xVUSnFK4x1wUaO_ZHubwaAg-BEALw_wcB&hvadid=259078774943&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9046844&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=5079323711290711855&hvtargid=kwd-295728428802&hydadcr=28145_1724733&keywords=bain-marie&qid=1573122042&sr=8-16)as sold by Thornes - but almost half the price.
Kitta

[Bridget]

Yes Kitta, very similar. I see you can get cheaper than the one you linked to. Once its going its quite quick, you just keep piling in the cappings or old wax. I used to stress about cleaning it and the muslin filter but have now given up on that and it works just as well, everything just melts as you fire it up. Had it for about 4 years I think


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[Bridget]

The Bain Marie pot I have as well (the cheaper one) but I don’t use it for that, I use it for the wax when I’m making foundation. I’ve not been super successful with the brood foundation but the smaller super foundation works OK and I’m going to use starter strips this year for cut comb heather honey (supposing the heather gets it act together after two dud years). We have a good local outlet for this and I’d prefer the wax to be thinner next year.


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[Calluna4u]

Easiest and cheapest for small quantities. Get a 200litre metal drum. Half fill it with water, put burners underneath and bring to the oil. Shove all your wax into a cloth bag, including a brick or heavy stone. Place it in the drum (can be easier to do this BEFORE you heat the water) and allow it to boil for a couple of hours. Turn off the heat and leave it overnight. In the morning you should have a nice cake of pure wax on top and a bag of slum. Tip it all out and repeat again with another load if you have it to do.

If the bag is too big and ends up fouling the wax later (not fouling as in contaminating, fouling as in contacting and getting tangle with) you can just stick a couple of heavy things on top to hold the top of the bag down.

[Mellifera Crofter]

Thank you, C4U - that method must be the easiest! It never occurred to me to have a method where the bag is left at the bottom of the barrel - so no struggle trying to press the bag clean of wax. You may think of it as a method for smaller quantities, but for me, it will take more wax than the wax melter I've borrowed from the Association up to now and, I think, it also seems big enough to sterilise or clean a group of frames tied together. I think that's the way to go.
Kitta

[Neils]

Apart from the poor poly hive having been chewed, Neils, will it withstand all that heat?

And how is it that the hive got so badly chewed? What make is it?

Kitta
i think it should be ok, with a cheap wallpaper stripper type affair can’t see the steam getting that hot.

it’s a payne’s hive from several years ago, there was no mention of needing to varnish it so i just put bees in it and they very quickly chewed out around the top bars. it’s been a frame store ever since.

[Mellifera Crofter]

I thought it might be a Paynes, Neils. I've had bees gnawing upper entrances for themselves in Paynes hives. I've sold mine now. Please let me know if the hive survived the steam ok - or not.
Kitta

[Thymallus]

Interesting thread. Been trying a few options myself and seem to have hit upon the reverse approach to Caluna. I take a used jute shopping bag (99p each at LIDL) and tie it like a funnel over a large bucket. (I add water to the bucket first). Wax to be melted on top of jute bag (your filter) and stick in oven at around 80C overnight. Filters most of the crap out and leaves a nice round wedge of clean wax floating on the water. Might want to run through a coffee filter (or similar) afterwards if showing or making candles.
I've also found that the stuff that comes off from a solar wax melter is good as the crap tends to stick to the slope as the wax and hiney slides down leaving a relatively clean wax block on top of the now bakers honey.

[greengumbo]

Easiest and cheapest for small quantities. Get a 200litre metal drum. Half fill it with water, put burners underneath and bring to the oil. Shove all your wax into a cloth bag, including a brick or heavy stone. Place it in the drum (can be easier to do this BEFORE you heat the water) and allow it to boil for a couple of hours. Turn off the heat and leave it overnight. In the morning you should have a nice cake of pure wax on top and a bag of slum. Tip it all out and repeat again with another load if you have it to do.

If the bag is too big and ends up fouling the wax later (not fouling as in contaminating, fouling as in contacting and getting tangle with) you can just stick a couple of heavy things on top to hold the top of the bag down.

Ive been wanting an excuse to get some burners for a while for homebrewing so this provides the perfect excuse :)

[Calluna4u]

Interesting thread. Been trying a few options myself and seem to have hit upon the reverse approach to Caluna. I take a used jute shopping bag (99p each at LIDL) and tie it like a funnel over a large bucket. (I add water to the bucket first). Wax to be melted on top of jute bag (your filter) and stick in oven at around 80C overnight. Filters most of the crap out and leaves a nice round wedge of clean wax floating on the water. Might want to run through a coffee filter (or similar) afterwards if showing or making candles.
I've also found that the stuff that comes off from a solar wax melter is good as the crap tends to stick to the slope as the wax and hiney slides down leaving a relatively clean wax block on top of the now bakers honey.

That's works too....there are a load of options out there.

[Adam]

I don't have a solar wax extractor so old combs are binned or go into the chimnea in summer as fire lighters. (Or they sit in a plastic bag in a pile in the corner of the shed as a breeding ground for wax moth :( ).
Should I buy or make a solar extractor. Could I put cappings in one for example? Are they worth getting?

[Mellifera Crofter]

I don't have a solar extractor, Adam - but thinking about it now, it might be a useful way to keep on top of rendering old combs as they become available over the summer (rather than leaving them for the wax moths, or rendering at the end of the season). Somebody else will have to let us know whether they like their solar extractor - or not.
Kitta