Queen not laying

[RDMW]

Hello
I wondered if there was any advice about this?
Yesterday was the first warm day here in Ullapool so I was able to have a look in the hives. Two are doing well, loads of bees and stores and capped brood and lavas.
Number three looks very sad. Lots of stores but very few bees. I assumed that the queen had not made it through the winter, but to my surprise there she was walking around on a frame of empty cells. She was a new queen last year, and had been laying last year so must have mated. She was marked and looks just fine.
I moved a frame of honey to face onto the frame the queen was on and put a frame of capped brood from one of the other hives, hoping some newly hatched bees might boost the numbers and stimulate her maternal instincts!
Can I do anything else? I suspect this colony will die but don't understand why the queen is not laying.
Thanks

[Mellifera Crofter]

I don't know either, Richard, but I wondered whether she is a late-season queen? Perhaps that could have affected how she got mated.
Kitta

[RDMW]

Thanks Kitta
That may be right because I struggled with that colony last year and I don't think she mated till late June or early July. Maybe she has run out of eggs?

[SDM]

She'd be laying drones if she had run out of sperm, you could try giving them some 1:1 syrup with a contact feeder to stimulate some laying.

[The Drone Ranger]

Hi RDMW
I think you have done the right thing just a matter of waiting to see what happens
The new bees from the sealed brood might get you to a point where there are some drones about and you will have more options

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[RDMW]

Thank you for all that. I will certainly feed them.
Drone ranger - plz could you elaborate on why having drones might help. Could the queen mate again?


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[alclosier]

No, you might be able to raise a new queen or they would supercede. I've got one in a similar situation one frame of 3 day old eggs and a few bits of sealed brood here and there. I put a feed on, see what happens.
They will either go for it or not. In contrast my other hive looks like Heathrow airport the amount it's flying and expanding. Good luck.

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[fatshark]

I'd be astounded if this colony recovered from the current situation if the local conditions are allowing others to flourish. I'm afraid I'd chalk this one up to a winter loss/spring dwindle or whatever. I wouldn't take resources from other colonies to boost it. By doing so you're holding them back.

[The Drone Ranger]

Thank you for all that. I will certainly feed them.
Drone ranger - plz could you elaborate on why having drones might help. Could the queen mate again?


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alclosier is right RDMW

Your queen cant mate again

The next thing to try would be a frame of young larvae

Hopefully the bees will superceed your queen if she is no good

It takes 15 days to hatch and around 7 days before a new queen flies

But Drones have to be available to mate with and they take a lot longer to hatch and be sexually mature

So depending where you live there might be a while to wait before there are any drones available

You could buy a queen and replace her but the problem is the hive may well fail anyway

[fatshark]

DR ... Ullapool (http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2635199) ... I don't know the area but suspect that sexually mature drones are likely to be in short supply for the next month at least.

"very few bees" in the original post ... probably not enough to keep the larvae warm and they're old, old bees ...

[The Drone Ranger]

DR ... Ullapool (http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2635199) ... I don't know the area but suspect that sexually mature drones are likely to be in short supply for the next month at least.

"very few bees" in the original post ... probably not enough to keep the larvae warm and they're old, old bees ...

if the sealed brood hatches there might be a chance
If the queen didn't lay at all during Winter I think there wouldn't be any bees left at all
So possibly she might stagger on for a little while
As SDM says shes not a drone layer
I have spent lots of effort on weak colonies and it seldom works out
I take it you think its hopeless fatshark

[RDMW]

Really appreciate all this expert advice. Thank you
I think the colony is going to fail, but am glad to know that I have not failed to do something which might have helped. I have two strong colonies so will prob do an artificial swarm later and get back to three, or catch a swarm.
Beautiful day here in the west and lots of flying:)


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[fatshark]

I take it you think its hopeless fatshark

I'm afraid so DR. Overwintering bees can last a long time - up to 9 months I think - so I don't necessarily think that a colony headed by a non-laying queen would have run out of bees by now. The amount of brood raised in the winter is generally pretty small, and if there's none sealed now she's not been laying for some time.

What's perhaps interesting is why she hasn't turned into a DLQ if she's poorly mated and run out of sperm?

I, too, have spent time and effort trying to save weak colonies (I may sound a heartless b**t**d but I'm not really) and have learned it's better to cut your losses. Taking brood from a colony developing well might save the colony ... but it might not and it's going to be ages to get a new queen mated. What it will do is weaken a colony at an important time in its development for this season. I'd prefer to have one colony bulging with bees (perhaps to break a nuc off later) than two weaker ones, one of which will probably be a basket case.

[The Drone Ranger]

Let us know how it goes anyway RDMW and whether the sealed brood hatches

[Jon]

I squished a queen last week which had not started to lay and replaced her with one from an Apidea.
The new one started to lay as soon as they had released her from the cage.
It is more usual to come across drone layers in spring but this one had no brood at all.

[alclosier]

Fatshark is right probably not worth the effort. I'll probably do as he suggests this week unless there is a dramatic turn around.

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[The Drone Ranger]

Hi Jon
You chaps are way ahead of me
I haven't done any inspections just a quick peek in the top
This is a tricky time if you have a problem there are not many options
I have a few spare queens in keilers which is fine but you need enough bees left to do something with
I dont know if RDMW is going to be lucky and get that sealed brood hatched
If it does hatch that might be a step in the right direction

If there was a patron saint of lost causes I would be wearing the medallion

[The Drone Ranger]

Fatshark is right probably not worth the effort. I'll probably do as he suggests this week unless there is a dramatic turn around.

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You have some brood in yours though alclosier so by hanging in there for a few weeks you can requeen

[nemphlar]

I see them collecting pollen, water, the tops are warm and the trays have some debris, but with temperatures around 7'c not sure how you guys have been able to get in to look.

[gavin]

I've only lifted frames in one of mine so far. I'll start on the next warm day.

Colonies short of supplies might not be showing any eggs just for that reason. If that might be the reason (due to dearth of workers for some reason) the queen could be perfectly good and the little colony respond to feeding and insulation. Or respond to an influx of hatching brood. Or it could be a queen issue ....

[Jon]

The weekend Gavin was over in NI mid March we had temperatures of 13-14c.
Been downhill ever since.
Colonies are certainly getting lighter.

[RDMW]

I see them collecting pollen, water, the tops are warm and the trays have some debris, but with temperatures around 7'c not sure how you guys have been able to get in to look.

It has been 12-14 on occasion here in sunny Scotland. Next day it is back to 6 or 7

[fatshark]

The only colonies I've looked at are in my shed. These are going well, with good levels of brood and even some nectar being collected. I carved out a pizza-slice piece of brood on Thursday last from one frame and, on checking today, they've completely repaired the comb and laid it up (as drone cells ... ). Going by the evidence on the Varroa trays these colonies are 2-3 weeks ahead of those in the open. The only thing I've done with the latter is check they have enough stores.

The OSR has well-developing buds now and the majority of my colonies are going to completely miss it. Grrrr

[nemphlar]

I was lucky to fly over the sunny north west the other day, very nice. Into Glasgow to 8'c and a cold wet wind

[The Drone Ranger]

I carved out a pizza-slice piece of brood on Thursday last from one frame and, on checking today, they've completely repaired the comb and laid it up (as drone cells ... ).

Pizza yumm!
Unusual topping

[fatshark]

That's the base ... Thick and Chewy, with added protein.

[RDMW]

Checked on a sunny day. The Queen is still there less bees. No brood and the frame of sealed brood I transferred has failed to hatch, too cold. I have closed down to three frames and fed thin syrup. It is still cold here at night and has been wet so still think this colony is doomed


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[SDM]

Checked on a sunny day. The Queen is still there less bees. No brood and the frame of sealed brood I transferred has failed to hatch, too cold. I have closed down to three frames and fed thin syrup. It is still cold here at night and has been wet so still think this colony is doomed


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There's no good news for you on the weather front either im afraid, looks like we won't see double figure temps again regularly til late may. Brighter in the West but temps are going to be the problem for everyone.
There was me thinking I'd need the fondant for mating nucs next, didn't need this just as colony numbers are really taking off.

[drumgerry]

If you want an accurate forecast for weather in the Highlands and North east use this guy's site

http://highlandweather.info/ - shows current weather from more weather stations than you can shake a stick at (including my garden!)

https://www.facebook.com/highlandweather/ - this has the actual daily and weekly forecasts and is more accurate than any other I've found and for a reasonable time frame.