Starvation alert

[busybeephilip]

This is where the bee house is good. In the winter cold it is only a couple or three degrees warmer than outside but it is never damp. I can light cardboard that's been in there for over a year. The hives are about 2 ft above the ground and protected from damp k

Beehouse sounds ideal, this evening and for the last few days it been rain and cold, my harvest is disappearing before my eyes ! looks like some rally bad weather heading my way for the beginning of August

[Jon]

Not looking good Phil. I took a dozen or so queens from apideas this morning in horizontal rain with the temperature around 10c.
The big colonies must be going through any excess stores at the moment.
I had to feed a lot of Apideas today and I have managed to avoid that for most of the summer.
It is a real shame about the weather as there is a lot of forage available at the moment, bramble balsam, willowherb and more.

[Calluna4u]

Not looking good Phil. I took a dozen or so queens from apideas this morning in horizontal rain with the temperature around 10c.
The big colonies must be going through any excess stores at the moment.
I had to feed a lot of Apideas today and I have managed to avoid that for most of the summer.
It is a real shame about the weather as there is a lot of forage available at the moment, bramble balsam, willowherb and more.

Its the same here in eastern Scotland. Many floral sources available but the bees (of all racial types) have brought in nothing for quite some time and hunger is becoming pressing.

Just posted on the beekeeping forum that I was out with the bee inspectors yesterday seeing a group of ours that were within the 3Km circle round a recently reported AFB case. Nothing was found after a full inspection, but the big thing is that they had NO food. They were in a sheltered spot between a big OSR field, and a field of beans, so had abundant forage up to three weeks ago. They now have plentiful bramble, lime, willowherb and balsam in flower within about a quarter mile, and they are getting NOTHING.
These bees (there are different racial types in the group but all are affected much the same) have had no honey at all taken from them and in a few days time would be in a bad way.

Feed tanks go out today, as starvation is now a very serious problem in these parts, and maybe worth a new thread on its own as many who are drifting along unaware of this developing situation might not pick up the warning buried away on this thread.

If there was nectar and the weather forecast OK then I would not be too concerned, but the forecast is dire, with a major storm sweeping across northern and western areas early next week, and the remainder of August forecast to be cool wet and windy. Now starting to look serious, and already we have a summer closely resembling 1985. Feed your bees now if they need it, and while the weather continues like this feed them little and often, it keeps the queens going and gives a chance of young bees for the winter. The losses in the winter of 85/86 were very severe indeed and the time may be now for taking steps to avoid sleepwalking into another similar situation.

All is not lost yet as long term forecasts are notoriously approximate and can be wildly wrong. However, just in case, we start feeding today in amounts to keep them alive and keep the queen active. Cannot afford any more than that!

You mention the Apideas, we have been having to feed them weekly now for at least a month, ditto the Kielers. The cell builders stopped doing more than a couple of cells on each graft about two weeks back, only responding better if fed continuously. Have now pulled the plug on all new grafts and cells for the season and winding the unit down for winter, a couple of weeks earlier than planned. The July queens are probably going to be problematical for mating quality and we are finding too many drone layers again, as was the case in May. Not a good season for the project, though the June queens are looking very nice.

[Bridget]

Its the same here in eastern Scotland. Many floral sources available but the bees (of all racial types) have brought in nothing for quite some time and hunger is becoming pressing.

Just posted on the beekeeping forum that I was out with the bee inspectors yesterday seeing a group of ours that were within the 3Km circle round a recently reported AFB case. Nothing was found after a full inspection, but the big thing is that they had NO food. They were in a sheltered spot between a big OSR field, and a field of beans, so had abundant forage up to three weeks ago. They now have plentiful bramble, lime, willowherb and balsam in flower within about a quarter mile, and they are getting NOTHING.
These bees (there are different racial types in the group but all are affected much the same) have had no honey at all taken from them and in a few days time would be in a bad way.

I hope you don't mind Calluna4u but I have quoted some of your post on our Facebook page, Spey Beekeepers Association, so as to inform folk of your concerns. If this is not ok I will take it down.


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[Calluna4u]

I hope you don't mind Calluna4u but I have quoted some of your post on our Facebook page, Spey Beekeepers Association, so as to inform folk of your concerns. If this is not ok I will take it down.


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No issues with that whatsoever. FWIW, just so you know, the colonies from within the AFB circle are NOT headed to Speyside. They have been passed by Steve and his team as clear, but will still be going to a very isolated location in Upper Deeside with no neighbouring beekeepers.

[gavin]

Thanks for that C4U. I've been wondering about sending an email round the local associations and will do now having read your post. Just back from the association apiary where I've let two nucs starve :( and had other colonies getting close. In my own apiaries the Paynes nucs are almost all being fed and some of the full colonies now also have feed on.

It is striking that the colonies without good laying queens (too many of them!) are the ones still with stores. Those raising brood are often the ones on the brink.

Are you sure that closing the queen raising unit early is the best way? The forecast looks slightly better from 5th August and even on days like today the drones are flying. Jon gets good mating into September.

[The Drone Ranger]

Hi Gavin
I have 18 Q/C near to hatch but I'm not counting my chickens
I have 8 or 9 laying in Keilers at the moment cover for any late failures
If I was you I would carry on with things at the AMM breeding station that really is a special case
But I'm inclined to think C4 is right and there's a potential for a lot wasted effort with so much else to be done

Let us know how the mini plus mating hives got on if you can

I have weighed up Keilers and Apideas and being honest I think Keilers are easier and better

[Calluna4u]

Thanks for that C4U. I've been wondering about sending an email round the local associations and will do now having read your post. Just back from the association apiary where I've let two nucs starve :( and had other colonies getting close. In my own apiaries the Paynes nucs are almost all being fed and some of the full colonies now also have feed on.

It is striking that the colonies without good laying queens (too many of them!) are the ones still with stores. Those raising brood are often the ones on the brink.

Are you sure that closing the queen raising unit early is the best way? The forecast looks slightly better from 5th August and even on days like today the drones are flying. Jon gets good mating into September.

A decision slightly out of my own hands.

1. Have plentiful mated queens now waiting to be used so would have only a little use for late ones.
2. Visited Jolanta and Beata at the queen unit today. Its carnage. They have never seen it so much before but the drone mother colonies are very forcibly evicting the drones. Literally thousands of them flying around trying to get into hives and being dragged back out by the legs and wings.
3. Still plenty pollen about but the bees think its over. I don't really believe you get the best results fighting them.

We got some good September matings last year, but the colonies carried enough drones through for that, and maybe it will be the same this year, but we have enough queens for our own use now anyway, to top up the nuc numbers to the full level, and to have some spare for late requeenings that might be needed. Not selling any more as I am not confident of the July quality.

By closing it down I really meant that no more grafts and no fresh boxes going out. The existing ones will carry on through August for us to take queens as required. Just the effort to make more that is being closed down.

Off to feed 150 Paynes myself now.

[Emma]

Here in my sheltered, flower-rich bubble I started feeding some bees last week, and today I've been swithering about feeding most of the rest. There's been a slight difference between the most profligate colonies and the rest, but not so much. (One queen's workers just seem to spend anything they've got on boys & swarming, this spring and last, then make a small nest to wait out the winter in - party bees! They were running on empty last week.)
I'm hearing lime trees humming loud whenever it's dry enough - but that includes times, like 7am yesterday, when it's cold and my bees are all tucked up indoors. At least the bumblebees are still making a living.
Drones, alas, are going out of fashion here as well. But there are still quite a few being hosted in the wealthier hives. And just one colony - one that needed fed last week - is even raising a few.
It seemed crazy to feed, as they've been flying avidly during the best bits of the last few days, bringing in many colours of pollen. But this thread is helping me shift to thinking that the bees can provide the protein/fat/micronutrients, & I'll add the carbs. Thanks for the heads-up on that, everyone.
Anyone got a good answer to the question most people ask when they hear you keep bees: "Do you get much honey?"
I _know_ they don't want the long answer!

[gavin]

Farmfoods seem to provide the best bargain for sugar at the moment. It has been 39p for a while and is still being sold at that price according to hotdeals.com. Tate and Lyle Cane sugar, 1kg.

[Jon]

Yiz are all making me nervous re starvation so I checked a few colonies this afternoon and most have plenty of stores and at least a super 3/4 full.
Must be an East of Scotland problem re weather and forage.
I did 50 grafts at teatime today into 3 colonies and hope to get a few of those started.
the grafts I did last week on Thursday started 24/36 and they are good looking cells.
I had 35 cells started from the previous batch the week before most of which are in apideas now.

I have seen a couple of colonies evicting drones and none of my queens are currently laying in drone comb but there are still plenty of drones in most colonies.

[Feckless Drone]

Anyone got a good answer to the question most people ask when they hear you keep bees: "Do you get much honey?"
I _know_ they don't want the long answer!

My answer is always "I get enough for my own needs", sends the right signal. And follow up with an explanation/admission that my honey is very good but also probably the most expensive honey in the world.

Jon - there is plenty of forage here in the east coast at present, and the soil is moist (we've had twice the level of normal rain for July) but its just the weather that is making things so difficult. And its been bad for weeks. This morning at 7, 11 deg C in a sunny spot, lovely and bright and the bees were really active almost desperate to get going.

[greengumbo]

Farmfoods seem to provide the best bargain for sugar at the moment. It has been 39p for a while and is still being sold at that price according to hotdeals.com. Tate and Lyle Cane sugar, 1kg.

You got an account with bookers Gavin ? We are about to sign up for other stuff but obviously I will tag on sugar and fondant supplies :)

[The Drone Ranger]

the way things grow might be a factor
Our small 5 acre field is waist high grass this year swamping everything else

[gavin]

You got an account with bookers Gavin ? We are about to sign up for other stuff but obviously I will tag on sugar and fondant supplies :)

Do let us know if Bookers is cost-effective. I invested in an IBC of Apiinvert this spring so am OK for a while yet.

[greengumbo]

the way things grow might be a factor
Our small 5 acre field is waist high grass this year swamping everything else

I am a whole-hearted convert to the church of yellow rattle.

Keeps the grass down and allows wildflowers to establish. Great wee plant.

[greengumbo]

One of my mini-nucs and another nuc were basically starving this morning when I did the rounds. Food on them both now. Fingers crossed.

[The Drone Ranger]

I am a whole-hearted convert to the church of yellow rattle.

Keeps the grass down and allows wildflowers to establish. Great wee plant.

I must get some pronto :)

[greengumbo]

I must get some pronto :)
Its a good time of year for planting as seeds are now shedding and it needs a good freeze to germinate. I might be able to get you a bag of seeds in the next month if you remind me !

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[The Drone Ranger]

Thanks GG
That's very kind of you to offer As it goes I already ordered some online
Might not have the right growing conditions so I thought a trial patch first
Apparently the grass needs to be about 1" long so the topping mower is out
We have a hayter rough grass cutter about 30 years old that will do the job

[Calluna4u]

Just an update on the situation.

We have the bee inspectors going round our heather sites verifying the EFB status of our hives this week. Still too busy down here myself but they reported back yesterday that the bees on the moors are less hungry than the ones on the lower land, in fact were working hard yesterday after the rain and had a small amount of nectar. Local bees, despite going like a train all day after about 10am, brought lots and lots of pollen, but there was no nectar at all in them even by early evening. Plenty flowers, but none of them appear to be yielding anything other than pollen. So seems like the hills are ok, the lowlands dire.

My team is at Hereford today, and they report that even there, where it has been much warmer and plenty of flowers, that there is no new honey in the last 4 weeks. No starvation issues, but no crop either.

[The Drone Ranger]

That's not so good C4u

Thanks for the heads up

[Mellifera Crofter]

Has the nectar been washed out by rain, or dried up by wind, or are the conditions just not right for the flowers to secrete nectar?
Kitta

[Feckless Drone]

So seems like the hills are ok, the lowlands dire.

Thanks for update. Did you get any word about what state the ling heather is at? Do you think the bees in the hills are getting by with clover and bell heather? Up in the Angus glens there looked to be a good flowering of bell heather 2-3 weeks ago.

[Calluna4u]

Thanks for update. Did you get any word about what state the ling heather is at? Do you think the bees in the hills are getting by with clover and bell heather? Up in the Angus glens there looked to be a good flowering of bell heather 2-3 weeks ago.

Much growling. Composed a detailed response to this . hit send, which deleted off my system, and the connection dropped at the same time....lost in the ether somewhere.

So...briefer response.

Bell approaching its peak in the important high up patches, but bees not able to work it due to weather. Second year in a row with a Bell failure (unusual). Last year it got scorched and was brown a week after it was still in bud, this year drowned. Near the roadsides the clumps you see from the car are already gone over, but they are not really important.

First Ling sprigs just coming out in the more sheltered places, but it is going to be a generally late season and if we get a weather window then we could have a flow well into the first days of September. So all is not lost yet. We only need 5 to 7 days to get to break even. Not totally despondent yet, we have lost more heather crops to too dry than to too wet over my career. No rain now needed till autumn time, and so long as the moisture is there we only need a few days.

As for the post before.... well plants of several kinds have a nectar yield that is only in part down to the conditions at actual flowering date, many require cumulative suitable conditions over the weeks, even months, before flowering in order to secrete nectar at a viable rate. Sadly both heathers are amongst those.

However, with abundant balsam, clover, bramble (and many others) in flower here right now you would expect SOME nectar. There is none, so it must be the weather conditions over the last month or so. This is the fourth year in a row the balsam has failed to yield before August. Plenty flower, just nothing in it for the honeybees in the early flowering period.

[Calluna4u]

And now the really bad news. Bees that went to the heather from Errol, which were not at all devoid of food going up to the hill, are reported by the inspectors today to have a (hopefully small) number of dead hives among them. Starvation. These were ok 2 weeks ago, and this is the absolute opposite of the situation they found yesterday in apiaries in the same general vicinity, all with access to Bell.

[Feckless Drone]

Starvation.
thanks for reply - sorry about the bad news. Past few weeks has been rubbish weather whenever I've been up high then the temp has also been down. I'll try to make sure any colonies I move have a good level of stores. I've put the supers on with foundation in already to get them started but I might have been better just to let them put some stores in the brood box.

[Calluna4u]

Last update for the day.....panic time... and lots of folks with their bees on the moors will have the same. Three large groups in our best bell places, fed before going to the hill, absolutely no food at all left and dead and dying bees outside a few of them.
As of tomorrow all other work stops and the last of our syrup must go on. Seemed as if it was going to be ok yesterday at lunchtime. Forecast for all of August is for NO settled weather and cool wet and windy throughout, with only the odd day here and there ok.

[gavin]

Hope you can get things sorted in time, that sounds dire. I hope to see most of mine tomorrow - they are all still in the lowlands, I delayed moving them. Various reasons: every apiary had colonies without laying queens and I didn't want unmated queens in the hills, needed to stay in to fight off an infection myself, had urgent office work, can feed them more readily where they are. I'm hoping that the better weather in recent days has got those queens sorted.

In contrast, Brian Pool is reporting three supers of probably lime honey at the Zoo in Edinburgh (and colonies hungry in estates in the Borders). He has posted a video of a peek in the hives on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/brian.pool1/videos/vb.1293489545/10207145356814297/?type=2&theater

[Calluna4u]

7th August now, and an update.

Teams now on their third day of full time feeding. Picture very mixed and not as disastrous as it might have been. Yes we have a few dead hives, and of course even one starved is a disaster, but from the reports coming back it might have been over 100. Not so, it is a very minor number, not fully assessed yet but not the end of the world.

Yesterdays reports were very mixed too, with places described as many hives just waiting to die, and even the ones with adequate stores in the same group just sitting there with zero nectar coming in, yet a mile along the road they come back and say there is a lot of nectar (bell) and that they need boxes in a hurry. Same bees incidentally had no honey on Monday...... They are very strong colonies and it is said they seem to have nearly filled a deep box in four days. I am sure this will prove not to be correct as they centre combs have probably been kept open and will have new brood in them, but very promising.

There is no discernible difference between these places. Aspect the same, forage the same, bee power similar, same type of hive. One needing more supers, the other close to dying of starvation.......go figure.

Keep vigilant, means that every group has to be looked at in isolation, just because a neighbouring apiary is getting something it does not mean you are, or vica versa.

Weather set to be not too bad for the next few days now, and if the flow starts up in all our places then the fat lady will (yet again) have fallen over on her way to the podium to tune up. Good. Fingers and anything else that springs to mind firmly crossed that we are through the worst of it.

btw, still got that situation on the lowlands too. Some apiaries had an abundance of nectar yesterday and other s had nil. Only a few left off the heather but again, a mile was enough to go from feast to famine.

[Calluna4u]

Hopefully the final post in this thread from me......

Teams back from mountains today. Been at places outwith the worst area...no major issues, more places needing boxes than not. Even the hungry places bringing enough in now that the immediate danger has passed. Hopefully in a couple of days the worst area will pick up too.

Nectar still rather sporadic on the lower ground.

[The Drone Ranger]

Hopefully the final post in this thread from me......


I was getting a lot of good info and advice from your posts in this thread C4u so I hope you can find time to make a few more

[Calluna4u]

May have spoken too early......

Checked bees up the A9 yesterday in person. Best I can say is that they are alive.
The night before near Amulree they were close to dying.

Bees on bell and lots of clover nearby too..........nothing bar a little whitish honey to keep them from dying. Feed tanks needed yet again.

At Amulree two of the places also have plenty Lime around too. Nothing, just absolutely nothing. Bell, clover lime. Nothing and they have been there for a month.

[Calluna4u]

Aberdeenshire beekeepers visiting some of my places in Deeside this coming weekend...........could be a dismal day! Ho hum.

Then my Italian friends (bee breeders) arrive on Sunday....not much for them to see either. Cannot even see much at our breeding unit as Jolanta goes off on holiday on Tuesday for a month.

[The Drone Ranger]

Thanks Calluna4u for the updates
I am feeding steadily now a litre or two at a time and they are using what they get nothing being stored
I should cut down the number of hives I have too many in one spot
There seems to be plenty pollen going in but just not enough nectar

It's the kiss of death when people turn up and want to see how your bees are doing
Tell them they jinxed you :)

[Calluna4u]

It's the kiss of death when people turn up and want to see how your bees are doing
Tell them they jinxed you :)

Lol.....I get quite a lot of association visits, mainly to the heather, but other times too. They like their picnic somewhere different from their normal, but the Aberdeenshire lot seem to have adopted me......not sure which way round that should be. It was grim last year too, all our low east places failed miserably but we got a decent crop high and west. They like to come to the area around Dinnet, not so much travelling. A few on here have been. I do not mind visits, either as associations or individuals. Nothing to hide and happy to give some input back into a lifestyle that has given me a lot of quality time.

Get roped in to do talks in the winter months as well, lots of them. I am always amazed that they do not get fed up. Got a whole week in the south of England in January..............not really looking forward to that.

[prakel]

Get roped in to do talks in the winter months as well, lots of them. I am always amazed that they do not get fed up. Got a whole week in the south of England in January..............

Without wanting to derail an interesting thread...Have you got any venues lined up in Dorset/Hamp/Somerset?

[Mellifera Crofter]

Aberdeenshire beekeepers visiting some of my places in Deeside this coming weekend...........could be a dismal day! Ho hum.


...Tell them they jinxed you :)

Jinxing C4U! That's the furthest from our minds. I'm looking forward to that visit and wouldn't want to miss it, whatever the state of the heather or the bees.
Kitta

[The Drone Ranger]

Jinxing C4U! That's the furthest from our minds. I'm looking forward to that visit and wouldn't want to miss it, whatever the state of the heather or the bees.
Kitta

Bring fondant like a bring a bottle party ��

[mazza]

Wow, it's been interesting reading the many different scenarios with feeding and starvation this August! Makes me feel better about my own experience...

I have bees in the central belt, and on the 6th (having read the warnings re possible starvation) I went out to check my colonies. All of them had been working through the frames of stores I'd left them after the OSR harvest, but all but the biggest colony still had enough to keep them going for another week or so. Biggest colony's supers were very light with almost no sealed stores, and masses of brood to feed (1 1/2 deeps), so dashed out that night to buy some sugar before the situation became critical! Also ordered a stock of Apiinvert and resigned myself to having to feed all 3 colonies from now until winter...

Next day was the first day of good weather we'd had in a while, and when I went out to put the syrup on the big colony its supers were already heavier than the day before! (Is that even possible??!) Six days of good weather later, and instead of having to feed it looks like I'm going to have 4 boxes of summer honey to extract between the three hives!!

Still trying to work out if it's just my inexperience or if things really do change that quickly...

[Calluna4u]

Bring fondant like a bring a bottle party ��

Well to my great surprise there was a good turnout in horrible rainy conditions, so it was just talk for the first hour or so but then the rain went off. There was not a lot to see really, but the assembled throng seemed to enjoy it despite the absence of crop and vile weather.

[The Drone Ranger]

That's good
Most people would learn more from the talk than poking about in a hive in any case :)

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[gavin]

Still trying to work out if it's just my inexperience or if things really do change that quickly...

Oh, things really do change that quickly. After this summer I've decided that the best way to precipitate that slight change in the weather that flicks the switch from dearth to plenty is to issue a starvation warning ;).

Checked the nucs at the association apiary today on the occasion of a tidying up party and a session on Varroa ... and they've also gone from being to light to being plenty heavy. Until now the big colonies were mostly holding their own but the wee ones suffering.

G.

[The Drone Ranger]

Hi Gavin
I find the strong ones are sometimes the most likely to starve
I could be wrong but in a dearth if I see a strong hive with lots of open brood that's the one I make sure I give attention and food because they can starve very quickly

[gavin]

Hi Gavin
I find the strong ones are sometimes the most likely to starve
I could be wrong but in a dearth if I see a strong hive with lots of open brood that's the one I make sure I give attention and food because they can starve very quickly

Perfectly agree about the amount of open brood being the risk for rapid depletion of stores. Perhaps my big ones were being cautious when the weather was poor.

[The Drone Ranger]

I suppose when nectar is in short supply there are lots of other insects competing and suffering as well and some hives are better than others in that circumstance
I think that's always been a criticism of Italian bees that they outperform other bees when there are concentrations of nectar like rape or clover etc
But when bees have to grab what they can where they can then others do better

[The Drone Ranger]

Sun is out hooray!

[Mellifera Crofter]

Well to my great surprise there was a good turnout in horrible rainy conditions, so it was just talk for the first hour or so but then the rain went off. There was not a lot to see really, but the assembled throng seemed to enjoy it despite the absence of crop and vile weather.

Yes, we did enjoy the afternoon, C4U - thank you! It was a nice mix between talking while sharing umbrellas, and then opening some hives later when the weather cleared. And, DR, I don't think that particular apiary needed and offering of bring-a-bottle - they were beginning to bring in some delicious-smelling nectar.
Kitta

[Calluna4u]

Yes, we did enjoy the afternoon, C4U - thank you! It was a nice mix between talking while sharing umbrellas, and then opening some hives later when the weather cleared. And, DR, I don't think that particular apiary needed and offering of bring-a-bottle - they were beginning to bring in some delicious-smelling nectar.
Kitta

You are an invariably polite and enthusiastic group and it is a pleasure to host you.

We went to the wrong place though lol....just two miles away, on Dinnet Moor proper, a place you looked in at last year, it was a different story. Many hives needing boxes right now. Some with close on a full Langstroth deep of bell honey, and from the way they are drawing every frame in a box of foundation all at once and little difference between the outside and the middle it is potentially a rapid flow for the next few days. Late for bell but still, after this season I will take anything. Off up with boxes today to a few places (most need nothing yet) before tomorrows deluge hits that area. 50mm of rain forecast.

[Calluna4u]

Checked the nucs at the association apiary today on the occasion of a tidying up party and a session on Varroa ... and they've also gone from being to light to being plenty heavy. Until now the big colonies were mostly holding their own but the wee ones suffering.

G.

Just come in for a bite of lunch and been out and about checking nucs this morning.

By lunchtime they have an abundance of yellow nectar in then near Meikleour, white nectar elsewhere which is balsam as the nucs are intentionally sited beside it and the ghost bees are there in large numbers.

However, the yellow nectar is intensely yellow, and staining. The white poly round the entrance holes is already a strong yellow colour, and it does not have any particular smell or taste. Not Lime therefore, and though it looks like it, the absence of a 'socky' smell and taste legislates against ragwort. Seen it in the past and it looks very like a dandelion flow, but very few dandelions around, certainly not enough to have 50 nucs going like this. Never mind, its food, stimulation, and I am happy with that, not really caring what it is from except from curiosity.

[Calluna4u]

Update as requested by a few.

OK, so starvation no longer an issue in the hives but the performance on the heather thus far is very patchy, and none of the patches are bright.

Aberdeenshire bees not too bad generally, though the very early up bees sat for several weeks and got nothing and so went out of condition and are not going to bring a harvest. Heather now at about 40% open. Maybe 35% of an average crop but still coming in.

West Perthshire has heather about 25% open and the same situation applies. Maybe about 30% of a crop on the hives but they are trying hard where they still have sufficient bee power.

The A9 range, from Dalwhinnie up to Aviemore is considerably poorer. Maybe 4 or 5 sites are doing the business similar to West Perthshire, but the rest are just starting. The Ling is only about 2% open in many places, especially the forest heather near Aviemore and the open moors further up in Glen Truim and Glen Tromie. More sheltered areas of moor other than in forest are more advanced and that is where the nectar has been coming in, such as it is. No more than about 10% of a harvest on there.

We need to get to 60% of average to break even, so the situation is very gloomy.

The nucs down in the lowlands and the breeding colonies were doing OK on the balsam, but that ran into a brick wall maybe a week ago and even two days ago when it was humid there was lots of pollen coming in but the nectar was almost non existent. Having to resume the trickle feed on the nucs tomorrow as the natural stimulus seems to have run its course for the season.

[greengumbo]

Sorry to hear that C4U. Hope things pick up but the forecast looks gloomy. My site eastish side of the cairngorms had ling opening about 2 weeks back but not been up to check them since. They had a block on fondant to keep them happyish on day 1 but might need to visit them soon to double check.

Not much laying going on in many of my nucs / hives nearer Aberdeen. Trickle feeding here as well but trying not to attract wasps is a balancing act.

Ho hum.

[Jon]

Lots of reports of little or no honey crop in NI as well.
Weather has been atrocious.

[gavin]

.... but they are trying hard where they still have sufficient bee power.


Mine are in an Angus glen and twenty hives there have brought in a total of 4 full supers of ling and some scraps. The striking thing is the difference between hives that were on sites productive until the moment they shifted and hives on a dearth: only those prosperous before the move are bringing in a crop.

Haven't looked at the nucs since the weekend but they seemed OK then.

There was no way I was going to hit a break-even point this year but I'm looking to be in profit next :-)

[Feckless Drone]

West Perthshire has heather about 25% open and the same situation applies. Maybe about 30% of a crop on the hives but they are trying hard where they still have sufficient bee power.


A jaunt up an Angus glen yesterday, sunshine and showers, temp 13/14 deg and bees flying strongly. But the heather looked past it in most places and I am not sure how much longer it is worth leaving colonies up there given I can get them back and get them ready for winter. I'm interested C4U, when do you generally take off whatever you have from the heather crop?

[Calluna4u]

A jaunt up an Angus glen yesterday, sunshine and showers, temp 13/14 deg and bees flying strongly. But the heather looked past it in most places and I am not sure how much longer it is worth leaving colonies up there given I can get them back and get them ready for winter. I'm interested C4U, when do you generally take off whatever you have from the heather crop?

We generally start about the 5th September. This year will be later. The heather is only going to come fully into flower on many of our places in the coming few days. It is desperately late. The queens are in full lay again after a long drop off and there will be brood to deal with (no excluders at the heather) but most of all we will have fully in flower heather, decent weather forecast, although sadly heavily diminished bee power (normal for the start of Sept anyway). Generally take us until the first week of November to finish. (You can still get poly hives to take their winter feed that late, in wood it is seriously problematical.)

Surprised you see the heather as past. Not been up any of the Angus glens myself this season, but maybe its the bell you are seeing as brown?

[gavin]

We generally start about the 5th September. This year will be later. The heather is only going to come fully into flower on many of our places in the coming few days. It is desperately late. The queens are in full lay again after a long drop off and there will be brood to deal with (no excluders at the heather) but most of all we will have fully in flower heather, decent weather forecast, although sadly heavily diminished bee power (normal for the start of Sept anyway). Generally take us until the first week of November to finish. (You can still get poly hives to take their winter feed that late, in wood it is seriously problematical.)

Surprised you see the heather as past. Not been up any of the Angus glens myself this season, but maybe its the bell you are seeing as brown?

The glen FD is in (me too) has a lot of brown bell heather - has been for weeks. I'm still hoping that the ling will hold out for that better weather coming in 5 days or so. There is likely a lot more ling higher up which could be productive for a good while yet, as long as we escape frosts. The next fortnight could yet save the season, too late for the Dundee Show but enough to save face with the relatives and friends, or provide a reasonable harvest to sell in the coming months.

[Feckless Drone]

Not been up any of the Angus glens myself this season, but maybe its the bell you are seeing as brown?

That's useful C4U, thanks - NOTHING FOR YOU TO SEE UP THE ANGUS GLENS - but I'm sure you've mapped out the best spots anyway! I was walking over patches low down and south facing. Hopefully up higher there will be flowers ready for them. Little bit of bell and that well past. The hives are poly - so OK, I'll put off and feed a bit later than I normally do.

[gavin]

LOL! We're on C4U's cast-off sites. At least I am, you've found another.

[Bridget]

Interesting what Calluna4u said in an earlier post re the forest heather. I am noticing a lot less in the pine forest near Glentromie. I noticed in May 2013 that the heather had taken a hammering in the cold east wind we had for several weeks. Last summer there was still large tufts of dead heather around but this year that has gone and the blaeberry and cowberry plants have taken over with very little heather which is hardly out at all. Else where there are patches of blooming heather and other patches of barely out. Today in the few warm sunny spells we could see the air above the bee house full of bees heading to/ coming back from one direction - the heather. Up until a week ago we had lots of rosebay willow herb, still some clover and lots of meadow flowers but they have all disappeared so it's good to see them heading off to the heather.


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[Calluna4u]

That's useful C4U, thanks - NOTHING FOR YOU TO SEE UP THE ANGUS GLENS - but I'm sure you've mapped out the best spots anyway! I was walking over patches low down and south facing. Hopefully up higher there will be flowers ready for them. Little bit of bell and that well past. The hives are poly - so OK, I'll put off and feed a bit later than I normally do.

lol.....yes I did formerly go up into Prosen and Clova. Lot more in side glens off Glenisla. It got a bit isolated from our core areas, the crops were modest and erratic, and some of those I had to negotiate with were a bit awkward. It was a bit of a PITA trying to deal with a large number of disparate landowners and tenants when in our current main areas (Deeside, Badenoch, and Amulree) we deal with relatively few people, getting up to 20 sites from a single annual call. It just ended up too 'out on a limb' for us, though we miss the convenience of them as they were a good 'bale out' destination if there were problems or we needed to fit in a few evening shifts. Without doubt the most productive area in the Angus glens we used (never went to Glenesk which is the daddy of them all. Bert Mason, and now his grandson, have that bit of prime country.) was Clova, from Glenarm near Gella Bridge up to a mile or so above Wheen. Historically there was a fabulous Bell area on the west side of the glen too but long since gone under trees.

From what Gavin says maybe you are the one who is in at Buckhood/Glencally.........whisper it, but you got the better of the deal lol. Lot of Bell patches especially on the west facing hill approaching there from the south. These should indeed be well brown by now.

[Calluna4u]

For those of you with nucs you might be ignoring while your bees are on the heather.

Out feeding again today. Nucs on site that I had to remove bars of honey from last year at this time to give the queen space, this year are very light. These are all sites with lots and lots of balsam. Another week like this and some would have been in trouble. The little trickle feed has been a lifeline to them, and rather than getting plugged like last year (when the trickle feed was not required at this time) this year it is vital, but one upside is lots more space for brood. Finding many of the Paynes boxes with 5 and 6 bars with brood. Should be a great overwintering for those. But watch they have enough food.

[gavin]

FD is higher up the glen than that, but with just a few hives no-one wants to be too explicit about where they are sitting. One quick visit by the unscrupulous and you are wiped out.

Yes, feeding nucs myself again. Hoping that in a few days the weather will turn the tap back on.