Wooden Postal Cages

[prakel]

Can anyone offer a link/contact to a European supplier who still sells the traditional Benton type wooden queen cages? I think I've tried most companies but hope that I may have missed one.

[brecks]

Can anyone offer a link/contact to a European supplier who still sells the traditional Benton type wooden queen cages? I think I've tried most companies but hope that I may have missed one.

I think Geller in Germany sells them - others there do too.
http://bienenzuchtbedarf-geller.de/shop/detail/index/sArticle/1097/sCategory/130

[Little_John]

Or you could make your own, of course :) :
www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXNyWD1LrBQ

[prakel]

I think Geller in Germany sells them - others there do too.
http://bienenzuchtbedarf-geller.de/shop/detail/index/sArticle/1097/sCategory/130

Hi, thanks for the link -I'd forgotten about them. Not quite what I'm looking for and the price is maybe a little steep when compared to the US/Aus offerings, even after shipping and duty. But there are a few other items on their site at quite competitive prices -I'll have a proper look later this evening.


Or you could make your own, of course :) :
www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXNyWD1LrBQ

As someone who builds his own boxes and mating nucs I'm finding it hard to understand why I hadn't thought of making them myself!!

[mbc]

Sorry to muck up your thread prakel, but why? The modern alternatives are head and shoulders more practical and cheaper IMHO

[prakel]

Sorry to muck up your thread prakel, but why? The modern alternatives are head and shoulders more practical and cheaper IMHO

I wouldn't argue with this to be honest. Some of the modern cages are excellent value and very useable too. Looking ahead we've put a lot of consideration into the possible use of wooden cages possibly for the wrong reasons -a different way of presenting queens being one.

Don't get me wrong, I've used plastic cages and would be happy to continue doing so if no viable alternative was available.

Of course, the idea of turning out our own adds a new dimension as to what may be possible.

There is some research which claims better survival rates for bees in wooden cages but it's only one paper, not backed up elsewhere so far as I know. Not a deciding factor for us but interesting none the less.

Comparing Alternative Methods for Holding Virgin Honey Bee Queens for One Week in Mailing Cages before Mating (http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0050150) by Bigio; Grüter; Ratnieks

[Jon]

I remember reading that paper a while ago. I would tend to agree with MBC though as you can purchase plastic cages for about 25p each if you buy them in any quantity. Swienty sell some very sturdy plastic cages and there are discounts for buying 100 at a time or 800 at a time.
I think the key factor is working to minimise the time in the cage. I have a few queens to post this morning before midday and I have not removed them from the apideas yet.
I try and encourage purchasers to have the nuc ready and waiting so the queen cage can be dropped straight in the next day.

[Little_John]

As I've generated a small mountain of wooden offcuts over the last few years, I've also been thinking about making my own cages - and I've even got a roll of suitable expanded mesh in stock. BUT - I'm a tad concerned about how these might be viewed by a customer: modernists might see wood as being a 'cheap-skate' approach, and that the queens might be of the same calibre; whereas traditionalists and the new wave of 'tree-huggers' (no offensive to them intended, just using a touch of short-hand ...) would undoubtedly see it as being a far more desirable use of natural, re-cycled material.

So maybe the simple answer is to offer customers a choice ?

Certainly at 50p a pop for plastic, ready-to-roll cages, it's hard to justify making 'em yourself from wood ... unless these were sold as being more desirable and thus superior in some way - like having a higher price tag. But whatever, I'd say "let the customer decide". :)

Re: that paper ... I'd have thought that the comparative volumes of the cages being used was a variable worth examining - but it doesn't even get a mention ...

LJ

[mbc]

Manlakeuk have the jzbz cages at 13.5p a pop. They also sell wooden California cages at around 30p

[Jon]

Buzzy bee shop has the jzbz cages around 20p as well. These are a bit small for posting queens though. Useful for caging queens in apideas for whatever reason as the cages are so small. They will fit between the front ventilation grille and the first frame.

[gavin]

Thanks for the suggestion about Mann Lake UK (http://www.mannlake.co.uk) - hadn't been there before. New for 2014 and based in Kent.

Buzzy Bee Shop (http://www.buzzybeeshop.co.uk) are clearing their wooden cages at £3.50 for ten (Special Offers (http://www.buzzybeeshop.co.uk/styled-6/page17/index.html) page) (VAT included, £3.50 P&P on any order wherever you are in the UK) and Mann Lake sell them at £4.15 for ten (cheaper by the hundred) (VAT to be added, shipping only free if order over £100, but ...... not Scottish Highlands and Islands or Norn Ireland!! Grrrrrr.... ).

[mbc]

Thanks for the suggestion about Mann Lake UK (http://www.mannlake.co.uk) - hadn't been there before. New for 2014 and based in Kent.

Buzzy Bee Shop (http://www.buzzybeeshop.co.uk) are clearing their wooden cages at £3.50 for ten (Special Offers (http://www.buzzybeeshop.co.uk/styled-6/page17/index.html) page) (VAT included, £3.50 P&P on any order wherever you are in the UK) and Mann Lake sell them at £4.15 for ten (cheaper by the hundred) (VAT to be added, shipping only free if order over £100, but ...... not Scottish Highlands and Islands or Norn Ireland!! Grrrrrr.... ).

I thought that place across the mickermerre was spellt Norn Iron?

[prakel]

Not sure how I missed the California cages on ML's UK site before although I was aware of them on their US listing. Not totally sure that I like them as it would mean buying into the feed-tube too. May well still end up adding plastic cages to the winter kit order...

[Little_John]

Not sure how I missed the California cages on ML's UK site before although I was aware of them on their US listing. Not totally sure that I like them as it would mean buying into the feed-tube too. May well still end up adding plastic cages to the winter kit order...

I saw them, but discounted using those for exactly the same reasons as yourself. I was also aware of the lower prices of JZBZ cages - but I really don't like those. Because of their low price relative to those of the competition I guess others must feel the same way, and so they can't be selling too well.

The best Ebay price I've found so far for the so-called plastic 'puzzle' cages (although the only puzzle I can see is "why are they called that ?") - is around 50p, so I was very pleased to see Jon's reference to Swienty. Very fair prices. Does anyone know what the shipping would cost for (say) a hundred ? Otherwise I'll have to open an account, just to get a shipping price ...


LJ

[brecks]

I saw them, but discounted using those for exactly the same reasons as yourself. I was also aware of the lower prices of JZBZ cages - but I really don't like those. Because of their low price relative to those of the competition I guess others must feel the same way, and so they can't be selling too well.

The best Ebay price I've found so far for the so-called plastic 'puzzle' cages (although the only puzzle I can see is "why are they called that ?") - is around 50p, so I was very pleased to see Jon's reference to Swienty. Very fair prices. Does anyone know what the shipping would cost for (say) a hundred ? Otherwise I'll have to open an account, just to get a shipping price ...


LJ

You can get the Swienty ones from Modern Beekeeping, or ask Roger at Paynes to add them onto his next order from Swienty. Either way, the shipping will be cheaper than from Denmark. Or, if you can wait, just ask Swienty to bring your order with them for the next Beetradex.

[Adam]

I bought a few Jzbz cages and don't like them....

I agree with Jon that time in the cage is crucial and the shorter the better. When I post the odd queen she usually stays in the mini-nuc 'till lunchtime and I then whip her out and take her to the post office so she is out of a hive for less than 24 hours by the time she's been delivered - often around 9 am which is pretty good. Sometimes I'll cage the queen with attendants the night before and leave them in the mini-nuc caged so the cage can be lifted out with little fuss.

[Adam]

On another point, has anyone used these cages from Thornes.
http://www.thorne.co.uk/queen/cages?product_id=4431
I have a few of these as well (never used) and I think they are probably good a chopping legs off..

[prakel]

Of the plastic cages I've used I think that I actually prefer the JZ-BZ offering because of the 'hiding' area which has got to help protect her feet if the recipient colony isn't quite ready to accept a stranger. Although I hadn't previously realized that they're
scented with a pheromone to increase acceptance always something new to learn :).

[mbc]

Of the plastic cages I've used I think that I actually prefer the JZ-BZ offering because of the 'hiding' area which has got to help protect her feet if the recipient colony isn't quite ready to accept a stranger. Although I hadn't previously realized that they're always something new to learn :).

Hands down the best on the market IMHO. The best feature is easy one handed operation for caging the queen and attendants, followed by the narrow release tube, easy storage(the battery box is good), hiding place, pheromone(not sure it does anything, but I get great acceptance using these), and the queen excluder sized hole in the end which i've never used. A good little bit of kit, and cheaper than chips :)

[Jon]

The shipping is expensive from Denmark and the VAT is 25%
You need to put in a big order to make it worthwhile.
I bought 10 cases of 18 Apideas in May and shipping was around 200 Euro but they still worked out at under £18 each which is cheaper than any supplier in the UK. (especially Thorne)
A vat registered business would be able to get them at a very good price.

[Jon]

LJ. I got 100 of the double exit cages from Abelo for £35 including postage about a month ago. They are on the website at 5 for £2.50 but I e-mailed and asked for a quote for 100. These double exit cages are better for introduction imho, but the swienty ones are better for posting. The abelo cages don,t have a plastic tab to seal in the fondant so you need to add a bit of tape.

Abelo cages (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxGcwNlMTAo&feature=youtu.be)

[prakel]

Not sure how I missed the California cages on ML's UK site before although I was aware of them on their US listing. Not totally sure that I like them as it would mean buying into the feed-tube too. May well still end up adding plastic cages to the winter kit order...

Interestingly, the JZ-BZ website says:


Now how about disadvantages? Takes time to pack that candy tube, but that can be minimized if you make about an inch thick pancake and then push the tube into the dough, like a cookie cutter !

BUT that objection is about to be eliminated by a revision which makes the candy tube a separate part which will be supplied to the user already loaded in a sealed plastic bag. All the user need to do is snap the filled candy tube in place and they are ready to go!!

http://jzsbzs.com/order/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=4&products_id=7&zenid=588696615a46c3d5239b3d8e6cbb104d

At 13.5p each it might be time to stockpile some of the current design for future use.

[BYF]

Not sure how I missed the California cages on ML's UK site before although I was aware of them on their US listing. Not totally sure that I like them as it would mean buying into the feed-tube too. May well still end up adding plastic cages to the winter kit order...

Just picked up this forum after many months- maybe even nearly a year since I recently got back in touch with Prakel. I love the CA cages and find the pre filled tubes quite handy. Always have some in my bee jacket pocket. You can also substitute your own candy, but it won't be as much as the tube provides. I like these cages mostly because here in the US they fit between our Hoffman self spacing frames quite easily AND you can see the queen. Perhaps that is a silly reason, but in the JZBZ I find it very hard to really see her. Generally I use the CA cages with a queen only, but I have also put a few attendants in. If we buy queens, then they send them in these CA cages, queen only, and a mess of attendants on the outside of the cage. I find it far preferable to install with just the queen in the cage.

[prakel]

Hi BYF, thanks for the input -good to see you back!

[Little_John]

Just picked up this forum after many months- maybe even nearly a year since I recently got back in touch with Prakel. I love the CA cages and find the pre filled tubes quite handy. Always have some in my bee jacket pocket. You can also substitute your own candy, but it won't be as much as the tube provides.

I assume the tube prevents contact between fondant (candy) and woodwork ? One feature of the old-style wooden Butler cages was that the wood would absorb any leeching from the fondant - which could be either good or bad, depending on how soft it was initially (obviously).

LJ