Observation hives

[fatshark]

I'm after an observation hive ... one of those portable 5 frame nucs with an observation panel up top. We have a couple in the association but they are heavily used at this time of year. Do any readers have a recommendation? Thornes do one which looks OK ... and has the advantage that it's in stock. Inevitably I need it within the next 3 weeks, so can't get some custom-made teak with brass handles monstrosity built to order :)

And to show just how little I know about these things ... do you fill the frame feeder before moving to the show, or once you're there? If the former, how do you clean your car up afterwards? If the latter, how do you stop Joe Public being exposed to bees?

With thanks.

[Jon]

It's all done before the show. You could use fondant in the feeder or fill it half full of syrup.
24 hours is enough at a show so don't let anyone talk you into donating bees for 2 days.
I did it once and the brood was a mess of chalkbrood when I got them back.

[Poly Hive]

A five frame nuc with an ob on top has issues, over heating is one, and keeping the queen on view is another. I had a discussion with a person determined to have a two deep frame ob, the frames in parallel osition and could I get them to understand that as an ob it was doomed as the queen would be in the dark the most of the time.

What I found to be very successful was an ob I made to hold one brood and one super frame and a shake of bees was more than enough to show at a school or a show. Take the bees out in the morning and replace at night and the colony left behind seems to accept them back no bother. I had bees, then glass, then a safety sheet of perspex, the whole unit was securely strapped to a heavy table to allow for pushing and shoving which WILL happen. So be prepared.

Bear in mind if you have an ob at a show you are going to need a lot of time and energy to talk about what you are showing the public, and be prepared to be told more than once: "Here, at's nae bees mister, at's WASPS!"

PH

[Dark Bee]

It is my intention to make an observation hive "sometime":rolleyes:
Can I ask if anyone has experience of the "Ulster Observation hive" ?

[Jon]

I have seen one in action.

PH. There is excluder below the observation panel so the queen is always visible.
the night before you have to find the queen on her frame and move it up top.
In an ideal world this frame has brood all stages, honey, pollen and a few drones.

[greengumbo]

I've literally taken delivery of one of those obs hives you are describing this morning so I will have a wee play tonight. Just need the bees to go in it !

[Poly Hive]

Hmm Jon and that makes it more useful? Better to take the two frames from a colony and replace at days end. KISS

PH

[gavin]

For those who have visited, or manned (womanned), the SBA pavilion at the Royal Highland Show you'll know that there is absolutely nothing to beat a free flying observation hive. These sustain themselves* for five days and - joy of joys - behave as they would do at home. What a delight to show members of the public bees doing the dorso-ventral abdominal vibration signal then going on to point the way to the prepared nest-mates in a waggle dance. Then show the onlooker which bunch of lime trees or field of spring oilseed rape they're talking about. You need a bucket for all the jaws dropping on the floor and you've just recruited a new beekeeper. Keep It Interesting .... um... Silly!

*plus or minus some syrup of course.

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[Jon]

PH. Taking two frames and a queen from a hive and returning them later is not KISS.
What do you think the hive will do without a queen and what might it do when you put the frames and a queen back the next day or are you suggesting you do it without the queen.
The design of the 5 frame nuc with an observation panel is well thought out.

I believe it was a Mr B Mobus whom you often quote.

http://www.beehacker.com/wp/?page_id=888

[Bumble]

I'm after an observation hive ... one of those portable 5 frame nucs with an observation panel up top. We have a couple in the association but they are heavily used at this time of year. Do any readers have a recommendation? Thornes do one which looks OK ... and has the advantage that it's in stock.

Our BKA has one of the Thornes observation hives. There are issues with it that needed fixing before it could be used. Sorry, but I can't remember what they all were now.

The queen is confined in the observation part, by a queen excluder, so she should always be visible. It's a good idea to mark her with a very bright colour.

This year we're experimenting by using it with one of two colonies - last year's programme proved too much disturbance for only one colony. We give them light syrup - in jars, through mesh at the top. I think that mesh was one of the modifications. They get hot too, so another ventilation panel needed in the floor or at the sides.

I don't think we'd considered using fondant, because of the heat they need the moisture and need the occasional spray of clean water through the mesh, especially on a hot day.

[fatshark]

http://www.beehacker.com/wp/?page_id=888

Thanks Jon, very useful. Slightly galling that Thornes sell theirs for £331 while Brushy Mountain in the US costs $145. The link above also has a UK source of spring fasteners to secure the observation panel to the nuc body - these include some with locks, some that take small padlocks and others that take a pin or zip tie for security. Not cheap ... actually, for the stainless steel ones with locks, bloomin' expensive ... but good for peace of mind.

I want to use this infrequently for publicity purposes, indoors so overheating should not be too much of an issue.

[Jon]

I still can't believe the price charged for these things. More than a complete start up as a beekeeper.

It is a nice piece of kit though.
If you use it often, you keep a nuc strength colony in it by removing brood all the time to other colonies.
All you have to do is put the frame with the queen up above when you want to do a demo.

[greengumbo]

I still can't believe the price charged for these things. More than a complete start up as a beekeeper.

It is a nice piece of kit though.
If you use it often, you keep a nuc strength colony in it by removing brood all the time to other colonies.
All you have to do is put the frame with the queen up above when you want to do a demo.

I was going to use a full colony and remove the 5 frames into the obs every time I use it but your way makes more sense.

[fatshark]

Thanks all for comments and PM's ... Big T have my order and I'm waiting for the postie :p I'll report back once I've used it.

[fatshark]

As promised ... my views on the observation hive from Thornes.

Your three hundred hard earned ones get you a 5 frame nucleus box with a permanently fixed mesh floor, a deep roof and a glazed upper unit for the display frame. No crownboard, which seems a bit mean when you consider the cost. The brood box has a simple 1cm hole entrance with a means of permanently closing it off (needs a screwdriver to ensure its closed at a demo). The brood box has permanently fixed handles at either end and battens underneath which allow good airflow under the base. It also has adjustable clasps at either end to attach the glazed upper unit. These cannot be easily locked ... I botched it with zip ties, but in due course will replace them with clasps bought from a company called Protex which sell a wide range of stainless and lockable ones. The same type of clasps are used to attach the wooden cover to the glazed upper unit, but here you can also use screws to fix the lid on.

There are no covers or insulation provided for the upper glazed unit. I cut out some thick pieces of Kingspan, wrapped the edges in duck tape and used these to insulate the queen and bees in the display case. This worked well. I put the bees into the nuc a week in advance and then chose a good display frame (BIAS, stores, pollen and some emerging brood, together with space for the queen to lay - from a different hive altogether) and added this to the glazed display unit the day before it was to be shown. It is not easy getting a suitable frame ... I added the queen to the frame, together with a couple of marked drones. Once all the foragers had returned I sealed the box, added the insulation and moved it to my garage.

The bees were remarkably unstressed when on display. I was indoors and the temperature was reasonable. The queen was laying well most of the day. The paint wore off the drones almost completely.

Good points
General build quality, snug fit, good ventilation.

Less good points
Clasps aren't lockable. The glazed unit is slightly too wide. Rather too many bees stood on the glass rather than the comb. Perhaps my frame wasn't completely flat? There was also a bit of brace comb built between the glass and the frame. Lack of any sort of covers or protection for the glass and absence of a crown board. The roof is only really needed if you don't have other 5 frame nucs ... perhaps an odd inclusion (or the omission of the crownboard is odd if they include the roof) as it is likely to be used by experienced beekeepers.

Needless to say ... these things generate a lot of interest and people crowd round pointing and touching. Small fingers could easily undo the clasps ... I'll be changing these before the next one.

[Jon]

Small fingers could easily undo the clasps ... I'll be changing these before the next one.

Yes indeed. A wee hallion opened the clasps and let about 20 bees out into the tent at the Balmoral Show a couple of years ago.
Added to the general excitement.

[fatshark]

What a wheeze!
Our H&S people insisted on evacuating the building should there be a breakout. "As for fire" the safety protocol read. I'd already refused point blank to have a smoker ready at all times ... knowing this would a) entail yet more forms and b) mean the building would be evacuated anyway!

[Jon]

I think bolting them to a heavy table is fairly standard practice with observation hives.

[The Drone Ranger]

when I was at school we liked to set fire to magnesium in the Bunsen burner or chuck a bit of sodium in the sink full of water --- Happy days :)

[greengumbo]

As promised ... my views on the observation hive from Thornes.

Your three hundred hard earned ones get you a 5 frame nucleus box with a permanently fixed mesh floor, a deep roof and a glazed upper unit for the display frame. No crownboard, which seems a bit mean when you consider the cost. The brood box has a simple 1cm hole entrance with a means of permanently closing it off (needs a screwdriver to ensure its closed at a demo). The brood box has permanently fixed handles at either end and battens underneath which allow good airflow under the base. It also has adjustable clasps at either end to attach the glazed upper unit. These cannot be easily locked ... I botched it with zip ties, but in due course will replace them with clasps bought from a company called Protex which sell a wide range of stainless and lockable ones. The same type of clasps are used to attach the wooden cover to the glazed upper unit, but here you can also use screws to fix the lid on.

There are no covers or insulation provided for the upper glazed unit. I cut out some thick pieces of Kingspan, wrapped the edges in duck tape and used these to insulate the queen and bees in the display case. This worked well. I put the bees into the nuc a week in advance and then chose a good display frame (BIAS, stores, pollen and some emerging brood, together with space for the queen to lay - from a different hive altogether) and added this to the glazed display unit the day before it was to be shown. It is not easy getting a suitable frame ... I added the queen to the frame, together with a couple of marked drones. Once all the foragers had returned I sealed the box, added the insulation and moved it to my garage.

The bees were remarkably unstressed when on display. I was indoors and the temperature was reasonable. The queen was laying well most of the day. The paint wore off the drones almost completely.

Good points
General build quality, snug fit, good ventilation.

Less good points
Clasps aren't lockable. The glazed unit is slightly too wide. Rather too many bees stood on the glass rather than the comb. Perhaps my frame wasn't completely flat? There was also a bit of brace comb built between the glass and the frame. Lack of any sort of covers or protection for the glass and absence of a crown board. The roof is only really needed if you don't have other 5 frame nucs ... perhaps an odd inclusion (or the omission of the crownboard is odd if they include the roof) as it is likely to be used by experienced beekeepers.

Needless to say ... these things generate a lot of interest and people crowd round pointing and touching. Small fingers could easily undo the clasps ... I'll be changing these before the next one.

Well I have now got mine populated with bees as well. Probably only doing one or two talks with it before winter. The nuc of bees I bought to put in it was really strong and a 6 framer so I have donated a frame to another hive. Mine also didn't have a crownboard so I will have to bodge one with some ply. The bees had built brace comb to the roof so it is a bit of a mess already and they were not happy when I lifted the roof and attached frame this evening. One thing I was wondering was to stick the bees into a full sized hive as they are in need of some room already. This would mean removing frames into the obs nuc for the times I need it. Hmmmmm.

I could just keep donating frames to other hives I guess. What did you decide to do with yours fatshark ?

[fatshark]

Hi GG
Mine are now in a full hive with their first part-filled super. I don't need them again until late September (if the weather is OK) so I just popped them into a bigger box and let them get on with things. When I next need them - assuming it's just for a day - I'll just take the necessary number and quality of frames from that or another hive, push the remaining ones together and expect they'll be OK for the few hours. However, but then I expect to have several nucs made up for overwintering, so I might be better to use one of them instead.

A colleague told me it's good to mark the queen with gold paint so she shows up well under flash photos.

I'm going to look into making a turntable for next year ... inevitably the Q is always on the wrong side of a static setup. If possible ill have the turntable clamped to the desk, with the hive securely (but rotatably - is that a word?) attached.


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[greengumbo]

Hi GG
Mine are now in a full hive with their first part-filled super. I don't need them again until late September (if the weather is OK) so I just popped them into a bigger box and let them get on with things. When I next need them - assuming it's just for a day - I'll just take the necessary number and quality of frames from that or another hive, push the remaining ones together and expect they'll be OK for the few hours. However, but then I expect to have several nucs made up for overwintering, so I might be better to use one of them instead.

A colleague told me it's good to mark the queen with gold paint so she shows up well under flash photos.

I'm going to look into making a turntable for next year ... inevitably the Q is always on the wrong side of a static setup. If possible ill have the turntable clamped to the desk, with the hive securely (but rotatably - is that a word?) attached.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk 2

Mine are out of the obs hive and into a full hive for the meantime as well.

Just seemed very crowded where they were and the tiny entry / exit was not helping. I'm only using the obs hive once this year so will adjust when needed.