A hive on scales

[Stromnessbees]

This season I would like to set one of my hives on scales. The idea is to have the weight maesured electronically and recorded by a data logger, to get an idea of the changes inside (nectar coming in, honey ripening, stores being used up etc.).

Does anybody know what equipment I need for this, where to get it and how much it might cost?

I would be quite happy to share the results on the forum.
If somebody else would join me in this exercise we could compare the measurements and interpretation of the data.

Doris

[Neils]

Only had a quick search, but something like : http://www.ourweigh.co.uk/bench-scales/cpwplus-weighing-scales.html sems to kind of fit the bill, at least in terms of the sort of thing you're looking for. Depends where your hives are located with that kind of model as it appears to only have a cabled data out, but it does suggest that there are other models with different data collection options available. No idea whether those sort of things are soemthing you could leave something permently on top of to take constant measurements though or how waterproof they are for that matter.

[Stromnessbees]

Thanks, Nellie.

I have filled in their special request form and will see what they advise.
Would you be interested to try it as well?

Doris

[gavin]

This is an excellent idea Doris. Allen Dick in Canada has been following a hive on scales in Alberta this winter:

http://honeybeeworld.com/diary/

Some of it is surprising.

G.

[Stromnessbees]

Thanks for the link, Gavin.

I had seen one of his graphs before (I think on the BBKA forum). He obviously puts a lot of thought and time into this. Please don't expect anything as complicated from me, if I manage to get orgainsed for it at all, that is.

I definitely need a system with automated measurements, as I won't have time to take daily readings. Will see what this company recommends.

Doris

[Neils]

Thanks, Nellie.

I have filled in their special request form and will see what they advise.
Would you be interested to try it as well?

Doris

I'm a bit lacking in Budget at the moment, but I'd certainly be interested in seeing the results.

[POPZ]

Thanks, Nellie. I have filled in their special request form and will see what they advise.
Would you be interested to try it as well?
Doris

Doris. I would be very interested in giving it a try, providing the proper equipment is not too costly!! - POPZ

[Stromnessbees]

Doris. I would be very interested in giving it a try, providing the proper equipment is not too costly!! - POPZ

Hi POPZ

I sent an email to Allen Dick in Canada to ask him what he used to record his data. He replied very quickly. Here's the correspondence:


> Hi Allen I liked your graphs of weight changes of a beehive and would like to set up a hive on scales myself. Could you please tell me what equipment you have used for this steup? I am in the UK but am hopeful that I can get something similar here. Best wishes, Doris

I just use an old platform scale which I had sitting around. You should be able to find something like it if you ask around.

There are companies which sell scales. Tell them you want an old one that need not be accurate or certified. They may have one in their junk.

> Did you not use electronic equipment to record the data?

Nope. We walk over and write it down. I often take a picture of the beam.

>You also provide daily temperature max and min, which I thought were recorded automatically as well?

That comes from the Environment Canada Website, twenty miles distant.


allenSo, now I've been told. No fancy equipment is needed. As it happens I have a set of old Post Office scales sitting in a shed. No excuse to go out and buy something fancy, just daily readings and a record sheet is what's required.

The snag is that these scales can't sit out in the rain, I'll have to put the hive on scales under cover and that's not possible here in Stromness (very restricted space). Bear with me, though, Ill try to do it this summer.

Doris

[Jon]

Hi Doris
If you can forgive me for mentioning potatoes again, someone is bound to have a set of potato scales for weighing spuds and these will be waterproof.

This sort of thing:

http://www.kingofstuff.com/images/English_Potatoe_Scale_004.jpg

(Just noticed it uses the Dan Quayle spelling of potato(e) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wdqbi66oNuI) in the url!

[POPZ]

Jon. Great idea potato scales. The ones that you have a link to are great but should be in a museum somewhere! Modern ones are made of an alloy and completely weather resistant. I used to have several in different fields when I was a commercial potato grower. The only other thing you would need would be a complete set of weights. They are hardy little tools, and in fact would make an ideal hive stand as well as doubling up as a weighing machine. I will ring a few folk and see if there are any lying around anywhere in dusty barn corners looking for a new home.

Or maybe someone up this way may know of some. All those potato/onion/bulb growers up Fife way?

[Jon]

I think that one I linked to is in a museum to do with weighing.
I used to see things like that at local auctions.

[gavin]

Can I share a post from Mike Rowbottom in Yorkshire, as posted to Bee-L last October?

Dear all

I have found a digital baggage weigher to be an easy tool for hive weighing.
It needs a strap or chain with a hook (made from a 6" nail) to go under one
side of the hive. Hook under each side in turn and lift just enough to get
the side off the ground. Take a reading each side and add the weights
together for the hive weight.

Typical scales weigh up to 100 Lbs, they hold the reading on the display
after it is taken, they work off a pair of AAA batteries, they fit in your
overall pocket and they retail in the UK for about UK£15-say US$24.


Best wishes

Mike Rowbottom

HARROGATE
North Yorkshire
UK

[Jon]

Hi Gavin.
I have one of those baggage scales and I bought my dad one for Christmas.
It's called a Balanzza (http://www.balanzza.co.uk/purchase.php?gclid=CN-bvNHr8qACFYou3goddyOJGg).
It is good for doing a one off but it would be a nightmare for what Doris is proposing where you need constant readings. You also need good biceps. I think the colony needs to be sitting on a permanent scale. There is a margin of error with the luggage scale depending upon how well you get the hive centered and you will end up over the 100 lb limit once supers are on. Some of mine were 80lbs+ in December with the weight of box, stand, crown board etc included.

[gavin]

Quite right.

[POPZ]

I agree - tried one of them baggage lifters this winter and not only nearly tipped the whole hive over but also realised it was time I needed to do some biceps toning! And as Jon says, it was very difficult to get an accurate reading because of the weight and angle it has to be used at.
Not a good idea I am afraid.
POPZ

[Stromnessbees]

Sometime during the summer I managed to set up my hive on scales in an old barn:

378

The idea had been to monitor the increase of weight during a honey flow and other fluctuations.

But unfortunately, due to a mishap, the queen turned into a drone-layer and so the weight just dropped away until I realized what was going on and requeened the colony.

This setup could work just fine, but I do fancy something a bit more sophistcated.

How about a hive on a weather-proof set of electronic scales in an out-apiary, with automatic readings and fitted with a nifty device that sends a text message to your mobile if the daily increase is over a certain amount. Then you could just pick up all your other hives and move them to the apiary with the honey-flow ...

... dreaming on, Doris

[gavin]

.... with an option for members of the local association to tap into this information together with an automated system to warn people if they were siting an apiary within 1 km of another one .....

(and a live link to a webcam to check that the extra weight wasn't the neighbour's cat deciding to take a nap on top of the hive .... )

[Jimbo]

How about trying to make your own scales. If it works I will buy a set of scales from you.
http://www.beehacker.com/wp/?page_id=55&cpage=1